A simple observation

[Lemegeton]

so according to most of the reviews out there this does not suck.
However having played the demo it really does feel like they stuck a God of War combat engine into an Elder Scrolls game.
while the game is clearly fun and well made the fact that its released so soon after Skyrim and being so similar is going to be its downfall.

this game will flop.

[Geoff_B]

While we're on the subject what is it with games starting off with the main character dead/near dead? Fallout New Vegas, Deus Ex Human Revolution, Mass Effect 2 and now Kingdoms of Armour! Has everyone forgotten how to start a game properly these days?

[Lemegeton]

While we're on the subject what is it with games starting off with the main character dead/near dead? Fallout New Vegas, Deus Ex Human Revolution, Mass Effect 2 and now Kingdoms of Armour! Has everyone forgotten how to start a game properly these days?

its such a lazy mechanic to be honest. its like they cant find a better answer to the question "how do we make the character a badass but have them start the game sufficiently weak so part of the gameplay is building them up or finding all their gear again"

there must be a better way then "you been dead"
im pretty sure the Extra Creditz guys tackled this question in their episode on amnesia

[theDreamer]

Ok, give one.

[Geoff_B]

Fallout 3 probably did it the best way. At the start of the game your character is born into the world. No preconceptions, just a completely blank slate.

I agree this wouldn't work for sequels which feature the same character, which is why I'm happy for Mass Effect 2 to do it. I just think it's being used a bit too much, especially for brand new games like Kingdoms of Armour.

[Vigafre]

I really don't think being born is something that could be used well in most games. Made sense in Fallout (I guess), didn't make as much sense in Assassin's Creed 2 cuz they skipped his childhood. I say this cuz being a baby or child is boring unless you actually do something interesting as a child. I really don't want to see birth as an opening in games.

Honestly, I really can't think of a good opening to a game that wouldn't seem cliche after the first time it's used.

[Lemegeton]

Ok, give one.

if i could do that i would be a games designer, lol.
i suppose the mechanic is not awful i just think its very overused

[Merrymaker_Mortalis]

I didn't find the demo that bad. Yes, there are stereotypes, but the game as a lot more enjoyable than other Western RPGs I've tried (Divinity 2, Gothic 4, Risen and 2 worlds [2]). I don't know why. Maybe the aesthetic is focuses more on fantasy than realism. I live in a beautiful part of Wales. If I wanted to see HD trees and grass I'd walk out of my front door. As a result I've preferred fantastical set pieces in my game experience.
Twatting people to death with a flaming stick was hilarious.
Elves who are built very generously muscular-wise was also hilarious (I'm used to twink-like elves).

Dodgey archery targeting annoyed me. It seems to have an auto target feature which is inconsistent. It either exists or doesn't. Also the arrow might not even fly in the correct path, i.e. miss completely. Probably bugs but in a Demo you'd assume the game developers would ensure it to be 100% bug free. So I'll assume it's bad game mechanics.

Magic system isn't revolutionary but I found it 'fun'. Spells feel more like an arsenal which you can switch between and cast manually opposed to pressing a key binding and it magically instantly erupts from your body. You actually have to right click to cast. However the tutorial mission does push you towards hybriding with magic. Magic does a fuck-tonne more damage instantly than the other combat options at that point, though mana is an issue. You can equip the mana regen items but it makes you squishy. What the player thinks is how you're meant to play is nuke with your spells and use melee/archery (when it works) to finish the bugger off. Bad game design there. The point of having a tutorial mission introducing a player to all combat mechanics is to leave it unbiased so the player chooses what they truly want, not get pressurised to choose the most effective. There will always be players who'll play the most efficient way, but when there's a gap this wide at the beginning between all potential play styles, then there's a problem.

Overall, the demo could have been much better from a game play stand point in my opinion. Little 'bugs' should have been found and obliterated before the demo is released (normal people will judge the whole game by the demo). Contrast in efficiency of combat styles should have been reduced so less bias is formed of 'how to play'. I will buy the game. The demo did its job (just about. The flaming staff killing spree sold it tbh). However I won't buy it new, particularly since the pre-purchase bonuses from Steam aren't exciting to me. I'll wait for a steam sale.

*For the record* It was two rats. So technically you did have to kill rats as rats is the plural of rat, and two rats are a plural.

[Geoff_B]

My biggest problem with the demo was when I picked up the bow and it told me to press the centre mouse button. I'm on a laptop with a two-button touchpad. I don't have a centre mouse button. For a game to insist on a control which a gamer might not necessarily have access to with no way to change it to suit seems to me to be kind of discriminatory.

[Merrymaker_Mortalis]

It's used for switching between weapons (scrolling). But it is annoying the game orders you do press a button and refuses to carrying in till you use it.

[Metcarfre]

Centre mouse button...? /macuser

[Dutch guy]

On 2 button laptop trackpads pressing both buttons at the same time is usually interpreted as middle mouse button. It is on mine anyway.

[RobertMc123]

this game will flop.

Considering the buzz picking up for this game and already advance copies have been distributed by Amazon and early sales estimates are really good.



Yeah this game will flop......



Ya jackass!

Fact checking is fun, try doing it.

[Geoff_B]

That does not necessarily mean the game is good. At the very least it has good marketing. There have been plenty of games which have been eagerly anticipated and yet have turned out to not be as good as promised.

[LogicSword]

Duke Nukem springs to mind.

[RobertMc123]

The difference being that the sales numbers are already starting to come in, early numbers show that it is going to do rather well. Making the blanket statement "This game will flop" just because you don't like it doesn't make it true, it's a peeve of mine that people feel the need to trash something because it was not to their taste. I have been guilty of it too and have forced myself to stop doing it. I could have said the same about plenty of games I didn't like, like the endless EA sports games or the Modern Warfare games. I could have said it but I didn't because I don't make blanket statements like a jackass just because I don't like something.

[Merrymaker_Mortalis]

Guess what guys. For *only* £3.99 you can get DLC for this game giving you a set of armour and weapons for each specialisation (str, agi, int).

Can't help that this is a little bit cheeky. The gear has stats and the incentive is not only aesthetics. It doesn't come bundled with some random mission or quest where you obtain the gear.
It feels like an out-right cash-grab. (A lot of other DLCs are less cheeky. They usually are just shitty aesthetic changes that you aren't feeling compulsed to acquire. This DLC pretty much feels mandatory.)

Still going to buy the game, but I'll ensure it's reduced tremendously first.

[RobertMc123]

And what is the difference between this game having day one DLC and Gears of War 3 and that Gotham City Imposters crap clogging up the new releases of DLC on day 1. There was so much Gears of War three shit on there day 1 it was sickening, this has 3 packs that just have a few weapons, sure it's silly money to spend but it was 3 packs.

I got the game yesterday, played about 2 hours of it and so far it's pretty good, combat is fun but feels very World of Warcraft. I know there are working on a MMO for this universe too so you can see the cross over here, the MMO will take place thousands of years after Reckoning. So you can definetly see quest design that is MMO-like. Also the quest structure is dated, in the last few years we have seen RPGs change and side quests and main quests evolve and change and become a bit more involved. So that is my main gripe about the game is it feels MMO-like with dated quest structure but I am still enjoying the game, definetly a fun way to pass a few hours here and there.

[Geoff_B]

I never got the point of DLC for weapons and armour. Are the developers admitting that what they give you in the original game is not sufficient to complete it, or are they looking to take money from you with the promise of making the game easier?

[RobertMc123]

I think they found a little niche market, the people that feel they need to buy this DLC because if they don't they are "missing out" on something. These people are out there and there are enough of them to justify this nonsense. I think it's bullcrap honestly.

[Merrymaker_Mortalis]

It's frustrating for players who want to play the most efficiently and enjoy 'gearing up' or 'power creeping'. This DLC makes those players feel like they ought to get it be to optimum, but risks making them to powerful early on and make content trivail and gearing up less satisfying.

Thinking back at WoW with the WOTLK expansion, my mage had 6/8 T6 and replaced very little gear gearing up from 70->80. Was very boring. Yes it sucks replacing gear you worked your arse off to get, but sucks even more never to replace it.

I think DLC for extra armour and weapons should be an aesthetic option only or gets shoved into an extra mission/quest series. What Reckoning did was an blatant cash grab. I will resentfully buy it though. Grr.

[EikoandMog]

So instead, effort is put in the minutiae, since that's where all originality can lie.

I totally disagree. Fantasy is broad; you can be wildly different. Where are our Books of the New Sun? Where's our Pern? Why are video games so damned conservative in their fantasy?

Goddamn it, you just HAD to bring up Pern, didn't you? Excuse me while I go wallow in nostalgia for the next 15 minutes.

Anyway, I'm inclined to agree that WRPGs are getting stale and generic. There's enough flavour in all of them to give it a pass but really, the two different styles of the RPG are spinning their wheels in completely different ways. WRPGs are becoming stale from a setting standpoint while mechanics and gameplay are constantly evolving.

The JRPG on the other hand is trying new settings but the gameplay is becoming so stagnant that most are going to a simple turn based system with some gimmick attached (I'm looking at you, Shin Megami Tensei). I commend FF13 for at least trying to fix some of the problems that the JRPG has had lately even if it wasn't particularly good.

[Merrymaker_Mortalis]

Random encounters can go to hell. As much as I love Pokemon, 15 years of that shit is grr. There's a reason I maintain a stock of 99 Max Repels asap.
In any other turn based RPGs with that mechanic, I rush the ability/item which does the same thing.

[EikoandMog]

I don't mind random encounters as long as the rate is tolerable. Suikoden Tierkris was awful for it for an example. I could take two steps after one fight and head straight into another.

[Merrymaker_Mortalis]

Final dungeon of FFIV was rather horrendous. I mean random encounter rate was fine, just every encounter was a boss from earlier in the game. As if,this dungeon was where they bred. So you'd have a 15min fight everytime where you had a good chance of getting someone dead. The dungeon layout also was a maze so, uber fun back-tracking. Also, no creep repellent mechanic.