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The "eat candy so you can punch people" thing didn't make a lot of sense until the "glucose powered prosthetics" concept was introduced in Dresden Codak, after which I was like "hmmm yea that makes sense"

Kinda dumb as a gameplay mechanic. I never bothered, I just always waited for the "free" point of energy to recharge

So I've got a (kinda) interesting question.

When was the last time you played a game with a health bar?

And I mean last NEW game, not an old game you've recently played. Since I played Fable III two weekends ago and I noticed a distinct lack of health bar, even though you had the option to turn off regenerating health on higher difficulties.

Seriously, why has mainstream gaming fallen out with the humble health bar?

Pokémon. However, that's not really "new". So, probably NiNo Kuni, which I believe has health bars, can't remember from the demo.

I think it's just a thing that's happening while game are still focussed on becoming more and more "cinematic" and apparently health bars ruin immersion.

It's ruins immersion WITHOUT them in my opinion.

I get more involved in a game if I have to peak at my health bar every once in a while to see how close I am to dying.

Even the numbers are good enough. Seeing 1429 damage being taken when you only have 1430HP left it perhaps the most nail-biting thing ever in a game. That or when only a single pixel is all between you and death.

The whole "jam on the lens" thing is just annoying and not tension filling at all unless you have Jamaphobia or something.

It may ruin your immersion, but I don't think most people want data thrown at them constantly, because, more often than not, that takes people out of the moment. From your examples of Fable 3 and the 1430HP thing, it sounds like you come from a more RPG background (sorry if I'm wrong), so HP, mana, and EXP management are part of your immersion. Again, I may be wrong on that.

For me, I can't be immersed in a game if I have to pop into a menu every three minutes, whether it's to pop a health potion or manage my 15 different guns. Granted, I don't really care about immersion, but it's very easy for me to get caught up in a game if it's just GO GO GO.

To answer the question, the last game I played with a health bar was Planetside 2. Also recently, I played Alpha Protocol, Saints Row 3, Dead Space 3 and Metal Gear Rising demos, Borderlands, Dishonored, Mass Effect 3, Anarchy Reigns, and Minecraft. The only games I can think of with "health" but no health bars are Call of Duty, Halo, and many other first person shooters.

You're right in saying I'm an RPG fan, since I am. But I think what you're describing is bad streamlining and interfacing of a game, if you have to go through a hundred and one different menus and tabs to get what you want.

I guess it's because I don't understand why you wouldn't have a health bar. I mean it take ups a fraction of the screen and it's not like it's useless information. Correct me if I'm wrong but don't most these game tell you how much ammo you have left? So does it display that but not health?

I know I'm probably complaining too much but it's just something that really bothers me.

Valkyrie-Lemons wrote:...
I know I'm probably complaining too much but it's just something that really bothers me.

Actually, I can sympathize completely.
Having the game withhold information just to prevent the user from seeing too much numbers or HUD elements annoys me to no end.

I'm not saying I want the game to show every single statistic on every item, skill and character that I have, because that might actually impede play flow, but I do find it very frustrating if I have to figure out which item is better by trial and error.

Don't get me wrong, in a proper context exploration and figuring things out on your own can be one of the most rewarding experiences games have to offer, but getting absolutely no information on gun effectiveness in any recent FPS (that isn't Borderlands) is not that.
I get that a rocket launcher does more damage than a pistol, and that the average FPS player doesn't really care how much more damage it does, but when the game gives you 4 different machine gun like options with no background then it just gets silly.

I was surprised to find no damage stats on guns in Deus Ex:HR either, but fortunately it didn't affect me much since I went through the game non-lethal.
(For people wondering how to get through the heli crash unscathed, I ran away. If you're not a gun-blazing deathbot then you can't protect everything :< it makes things a bit grim, but for me it added a lot more weight to the rest of the game)

Mara.

I've always thought that there should always be three layers of information in games regarding data.

1) Essential data - Things like Health, MP, Ammo etc. (where applicable) and should be in the HUD

2) Important data- Things like attack stats, defence stats, resistances, rate of fire etc. And these should be easily accessible from a menu.

3) Miscellaneous data- Things like time in game, distance travelled, mouse clicks etc. And these should be in it's only little menu tab tucked away from everything else.


And the thing about trail and error, I totally agree. It's nice to stumble upon a really effective weapon combination or a power that is actually really useful, but when it's trail and error on just working out how to play the game 'properly'...that's annoying.

And I can understand when a game doesn't stat weapons so that they're all the same to allow for more personal choice rather than using a weapon just because it has +4 more attack or the like. But then you can just do what Skyrim did and make all the weapon types have different attack values, but each essentially balance out in terms of speed, weight and cost.

I've been meaning to try a HUD-less shooter. I know some of the COD-ish games have that option, anybody know which ones?

I remember a long time ago we had a thread going spitballing a completely HUDless, immersive action shooter with Alex. That was fun.

I really liked LA Noire for immersion. How it implemented all the usual "game" stuff was intuitive and didn't detract from the flow of the game.

Only thing I don't like about LA Noire is that it doesn't let you save wherever you want, instead if you screw up an interrogation and want to do it over you have to go back to the start of that section (and have to dig up all the clues again!)

Yeah, but I like games that discourage you from doing that and make you just play through once. I ain't got time for that crap.

The thing of FPS games is that the gun effectiveness usually doesn't matter (I'm talking games like Call of Duty, not like Borderlands or Deus Ex). The only time that does matter is in multiplayer, and it does actually tell you gun stats there.

Also, if you're playing a "sim" shooter (COD etc), they try to model their firearms after the real deal, and if you're playing you likely know the real-world stats for each of the ubiquitous types (M4, AK, MP5, etc.).

Metcarfre wrote:Also, if you're playing a "sim" shooter (COD etc), they try to model their firearms after the real deal, and if you're playing you likely know the real-world stats for each of the ubiquitous types (M4, AK, MP5, etc.).

I hate to be pedantic, but are you really calling things like CoD a "sim" shooter? Since the fact that you take a few bullets before dying, negate any long lasting effect and then regenerate health* makes the notion of it being a sim a bit silly.

But the other thing is that what it does is make it hard to play for anyone who isn't "in the know" so to speak. It really curves accessibility for those not willing to spend ages on wikipedia looking at the different gun types.

*Not sure if you can disable that on higher difficulties since I don't really play FPSs


EDIT: Spelling and grammar, which was shockingly bad when I re-read this. : /

You hate to be pedantic but you did it anyways?

"Sim" (in SCARY QUOTE MARKS no less) in that it at least approaches simulation of real-world weapons and etc. as opposed to toony/actiony/etc. stuff. Obviously there's going to be harder and softer versions.

Also, as I said, the gun differences in single player are almost insignificant, since every weapon will kill your enemies. The guns in most FPS games are not loot drops; you aren't given bad weapons. My statement about multiplayer stats for the guns still applies, as well. What Met was saying was more of an added bonus, not a necessity.

Try playing through a Brothers in Arms game in Authentic mode. Pretty much HUDless, and pretty realistic. (As in taking a single shot to the torso or head will kill you. Weapon damage is pretty accurate and weapons all behave differently)

Dutch guy wrote:Try playing through a Brothers in Arms game in Authentic mode. Pretty much HUDless, and pretty realistic. (As in taking a single shot to the torso or head will kill you. Weapon damage is pretty accurate and weapons all behave differently)

See, that a FPS I'd like to play. And I could actually bare playing a multiplayer session if the same rules could carry over, with no respawns.

Instead of everyone running around like a clusterbus you'd get people taking more time to think through a strategy.

Does that make me boring that I think it's more fun to plan and successfully execute a well thought out move, than to just doing running and gunning? : /

Not really. It just sounds like you prefer strategy over immediate gratification. No harm in that.

I, however, am not one of those people. Mostly because I cannot think more than 2 steps ahead.

I just like shooting people in the face.

What is it with games that make me cry lately. First The Walking Dead and now To The Moon. Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining, both were beautiful, but why did I have to play them a week before deadlines.

These days I am playing Temple Runner game on my brother’s iPod which is really interesting and i/m trying to finish at least 10000 meters.

RedNightmare wrote:What is it with games that make me cry lately. First The Walking Dead and now To The Moon. Don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining, both were beautiful, but why did I have to play them a week before deadlines.

Its funny, more games have made me cry then movies or tv shows (think Big Fish is the only movie that has made me cry). Disgaea 1 & 3, Phantom Brave and Journey are all games that made me cry at one point or another, and there are probably more that I just don't remember right now.

Mass Effect 3 made me cry. And that's not a crack at the ending it was for legitimate reasons.

I find games pretty terrible at telling stories so they generally have little emotional impact on me.