TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Discuss our latest podcast about Magic: The Gathering.
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TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Graham » 02 Oct 2013, 03:55

Graham walks you through some of the myths and legends behind the cards in Theros.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Muscadine » 02 Oct 2013, 05:33

Nylea is the analog of Artemis, not Athena.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby deathjavu » 02 Oct 2013, 06:13

Wow, you guys hit 3 cards (by my count) from the MTGO cube. Survival, Carnopage and Wood Elves. Nice pack, I guess.

Heliod is pretty clearly Helios: they're both god of the Sun and the names are just one letter off. (Helios was the one who drove the sun around in a chariot)
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby RedNightmare » 02 Oct 2013, 06:19

Graham, quick question: what is a good book (or site or whatever) to read for a lot of Greek myths and characters. I'm thinking of making a Greek inspired D&D setting and want to do research.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby ElFuzzy » 02 Oct 2013, 06:53

I recently heard of Izanagi and Izanami from Persona! Yay learning!
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Graham » 02 Oct 2013, 07:02

Muscadine wrote:Nylea is the analog of Artemis, not Athena.
Keeeeeep watching...
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Graham » 02 Oct 2013, 07:04

deathjavu wrote:Heliod is pretty clearly Helios: they're both god of the Sun and the names are just one letter off. (Helios was the one who drove the sun around in a chariot)
I guess I should have at least MENTIONED Helios, but apart from the name they're not that similar. Heliod is not a sun god, and he's clearly a Zeus analog more than anything.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Dave » 02 Oct 2013, 07:28

But it says heloid, god of the sun
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Mr.Wizard » 02 Oct 2013, 07:36

I found this cast really interesting... but I don't think James would agree with me. He looked SUPER bored.

I think it's probably because I don't really play Magic so the flavour is mostly what I like about watching games, rather than the mechanical interactions.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Foxmar » 02 Oct 2013, 07:54

I really liked this episode. Have always been a fan of all kinds of mythology. Graham did you have to look most of this up before recording or did you just know most of it from school or other reasons?
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Graham » 02 Oct 2013, 08:35

Dave wrote:But it says heloid, god of the sun
SHUT UP I CAN READ
Yeah you're right.

He's still the Zeus of Theros.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby square1 » 02 Oct 2013, 08:44

Purphoros as the Hephaestus analog is a really good pick for red. In Rome he was known as Vulcan and is the root for volcano, which is very in flavor for red.

Thanks very much for this! It was a great cast.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Lord Hosk » 02 Oct 2013, 08:53

I really love the point Graham made of "Well a lot of Greek myths get attributed to Hercules because he was a very popular character if you need a story you just sort of overwrite the hero..."

I dont have the depth of knowledge that Graham seems to have but I too was raised on the Iliad the Odyssey and a book called The Tasks of Heracles and other adventures of Greek Heros. So it always annoyed me when the TV show would toss other things on Herk "Golden apples come on that was Hippo-Man! not Herk"
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby TheHokeyPokey » 02 Oct 2013, 09:22

This podcast is always interesting/awkward for me. It is interesting to hear perspectives from newer players, although I do a lot of face-palming. Especially depressing are your evaluations of older creatures. If the ridiculous creature power creep continues as it has been, in ten years time unconditional 3/3s for one are going to be normal.

Zeus+Leda=Helen of Troy(super relevant)
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Bergie » 02 Oct 2013, 10:06

As a not-fan of MTG, but a fan of LRR, I tend to watch these anyway because it is a big enough part of geek culture that a working understanding of MTG is essential. That said, this was easily my favourate TTC that you've ever done! Even when I played MTG, I was more of a fluff-guy, and I love Greek Myth, so out of the park!

I will agree, though, that James did look bored.

Oh, and from what I can make out from the card and my own understading, I agree with Graham re: Heliod - He is superficially Helios, but functionally Zeus. Also, Helios ISN'T a god, he's a Titan (or, at least another of the offspring of the Titans like the Gods), so having him as a God brings up more issues. As to the issues of Red being Hephaestus, and not Ares, remember that in GREEK Mythology, Ares was a chump. The REAL War God was Athena who was the honourable strategist, while Ares portfolio was simply destruction and mayhem. It wasn't until the Romans came to the fore that Ares (in their Myth's, Mars) became more influential.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Gamercow » 02 Oct 2013, 12:21

Hmm, I wonder if they're going to get all of the major constellations that originated in Greek mythology. Probably. They've got Cygnus, Canis Major and Minor, I'll have to check the card list to see what others show up. I imagine Aquila is a no brainer. Giant golden eagle would be an awesome Magic card.

Now I want to go buy MtG cards, even though I don't play.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Lord Hosk » 02 Oct 2013, 14:14

TheHokeyPokey wrote:This podcast is always interesting/awkward for me. It is interesting to hear perspectives from newer players, although I do a lot of face-palming. Especially depressing are your evaluations of older creatures. If the ridiculous creature power creep continues as it has been, in ten years time unconditional 3/3s for one are going to be normal.

Zeus+Leda=Helen of Troy(super relevant)


the power creep is more of a power wave now, They have established right about where they want to be, sometimes its more powerful sometimes less. There are some cards in M14 like Canyon minotaur, that have fluctuated between good and meh, im M13 Pillarfield Ox was a 26th card, that card where you had nothing between 3 and 5 and only had 9 creatures so you could really use SOMETHING, ANYTHING. Now he fits the curve and isnt a top card but he is in the 20-23rd card slot. Same card different environment.

Pikers at 2/1 for 1R have been around since what 5th edition/portals and they have been pretty good and terrible up and down but they keep coming back and keep getting play.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby UNHchabo » 02 Oct 2013, 17:13

One easy combo I thought of for Pyxis of Pandemonium:

Scry the top of your deck, using the many Theros cards with this ability. If you look at a card that you would otherwise put on the bottom of your deck, put it back on top and use the Pyxis' ability to exile it instead. This will also make your opponent lose an unknown card from their deck, hopefully a good one. Then just never use the Pyxis' second ability.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby TheHokeyPokey » 02 Oct 2013, 19:59

Lord Hosk wrote:Pikers at 2/1 for 1R have been around since what 5th edition/portals and they have been pretty good and terrible up and down but they keep coming back and keep getting play.

Except now pikers cost 1U, have flash, and recast a card in the yard. Jackal Pup and Watch Wolf used to be exciting and powerful. Now they print strictly better versions and they still probably aren't good enough for standard. Power creep isn't really an issue for limited play because they are closed environments. Older creatures are getting shut out of eternal formats, and pretty soon Tarmogoyf is going to be the oldest creature playable.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby korvys » 02 Oct 2013, 20:23

Yes, but power creep is pretty much the reason for eternal formats. It's simply a matter of card selection. With no cards rotating out, every new card adds to the power of the formats, by giving new options. Even if they printed worse cards every time, some card would fill some niche, and make an existing deck more powerful.

What would you suggest? Stop making cards? Just reprint existing cards? Make weaker and weaker new cards each time?

If you don't want power creep (which is actually complexity creep, but nevermind) you don't want to play an eternal format.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby BenMarc » 03 Oct 2013, 00:06

Re: the whole labeling sets as beginner, advanced, or expert: I'm pretty sure 7th edition was advanced. But yeah, it wasn't all that common.

EDIT: Also, I wish to know more about this "Terrible Red Discard Commander Deck" of yours, Graham.

EDIT2: There is a god of war on Theros. Two, actually: Iroas and Mogis, the "Twins of War". In fact, if you pay attention to the cards and the flavor articles on the MtG website, you can figure out who most of the other gods are, as well as (more or less) what their domains are.

wu: Ephara - god of magic
ub: Phenax - god of lies and manipulation
br: Mogis - god of madness and slaughter
gw: Karametra - god of the hearth, home, and family
wb: Athreos - god of fate, ferryman of the dead
ur: Keranos - god of storms, inspiration, and prophecy
bg: Pharika - god of poison and medicine
rw: Iroas - god of victory and honor
gu: Kruphix - god of horizons, enigmas, and time
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Dothar Vahlin » 03 Oct 2013, 02:40

One way to build a deck around Pyxis of Pandemonium is to build a deck that only has permanents in it. Most decks run a certain number of instants and sorceries so each time you randomly exile one of those on your opponents side you will get ahead on 'permanent count'. On top of that make sure that a lot of your permanents have enter the battlefield abilities, so you can benefit from those. Especially things like Angel of Serenity and Acidic Slime that help you get ahead on board presences even more. Also manarocks or permanents that let you search for lands will be helpful. Because those let you ramp into the 7 mana you need to activate it and they filter land out of your library so you are more likely to hit some action.
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby mbooma » 03 Oct 2013, 06:09

Graham your shirt is amazing in this clip. Is it a new one you guys will be doing or where did you get it?

as for the triad of the fates, i believe the second ability can prolong the life of a creature by "flickering" it, turning it into an illegal target, or removing it from battle after assigning into blocking. :)
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby plummeting_sloth » 03 Oct 2013, 07:01

For further knowledgeification, Scylla and Charybdis likely referred to treacherous Straight of Messina, between Sicily and Calabria in Southern Italy. And to answer Kathleen's question, you often did not want to go the long way, as it put you at more risk of Sicilian pirates
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Re: TTC - Theros Flavour & Origins

Postby Eric the Orange » 03 Oct 2013, 10:05

Some one an correct me on this but I believe there were only 3 gorgons. It was Medusa and her 2 sisters whose names escape me.

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