The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

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RytelCSF
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby RytelCSF » 04 Oct 2010, 11:15

The Mycoloth/Mitotic Slime interaction doesn't actually work the way you claim. The problem is that the Devour ability requires you to choose what creatures you sacrifice and then sacrifice them all at once. You can't sacrifice the Slime, then wait for it to make tokens, then sacrifice those, etc.* So in that case, you can only get counters from the original Slime, and not all seven.

That said, the Slime does combo very well with stuff with "Sacrifice a creature: Thing" effects, so building a deck around it is solid. In fact, for such a deck, I'd recommend Makeshift Mannequin, which would allow you to recur the Slime at instant speed, i.e., in the middle of combat, for example.

*In fact, I believe the trigger that generates the tokens doesn't even go on the stack until the devouring is done, but I'm no judge and don't want to spread misinformation.
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Yaxley » 04 Oct 2010, 12:58

So after watching the crew talk about MtG on Twitter, I broke down and bought some cards for the first time in eight years. Here's hoping this isn't like a recovering alcoholic saying, "Aw, I'll just have one drink for old time's sake." Now I need to go find the rules online because the pamphlet they include these days doesn't explain the rules at all.

EDIT: Apparently they added a new level of rarity since I last played, and I got one in one of the two packs I bought. The internet tells me it is worth $40. Perhaps this is a sign I should sell it for a profit and walk away.
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Matt » 04 Oct 2010, 13:25

Yaxley wrote:So after watching the crew talk about MtG on Twitter, I broke down and bought some cards for the first time in eight years. Here's hoping this isn't like a recovering alcoholic saying, "Aw, I'll just have one drink for old time's sake." Now I need to go find the rules online because the pamphlet they include these days doesn't explain the rules at all.

EDIT: Apparently they added a new level of rarity since I last played, and I got one in one of the two packs I bought. The internet tells me it is worth $40. Perhaps this is a sign I should sell it for a profit and walk away.


which mythic did you get?

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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Yaxley » 04 Oct 2010, 13:52

Matt wrote:which mythic did you get?

-m

Some dude called Venser, the Sojourner. The thrill was lessened by the fact that I had no idea what a Planeswalker was or how they worked.
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Matt » 04 Oct 2010, 13:55

planeswalkers are actually opretty sweet cards. I wish there was one that reasonably fit the theme of my deck.

-m
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Trymantha » 04 Oct 2010, 14:46

RytelCSF wrote:The Mycoloth/Mitotic Slime interaction doesn't actually work the way you claim. The problem is that the Devour ability requires you to choose what creatures you sacrifice and then sacrifice them all at once. You can't sacrifice the Slime, then wait for it to make tokens, then sacrifice those, etc.* So in that case, you can only get counters from the original Slime, and not all seven.

That said, the Slime does combo very well with stuff with "Sacrifice a creature: Thing" effects, so building a deck around it is solid. In fact, for such a deck, I'd recommend Makeshift Mannequin, which would allow you to recur the Slime at instant speed, i.e., in the middle of combat, for example.

*In fact, I believe the trigger that generates the tokens doesn't even go on the stack until the devouring is done, but I'm no judge and don't want to spread misinformation.


you are coerrect, you cant devour the slime and all its tokens at once you have to declare what it is devouring all at once and it all happens at the same time, think of it like this, the new oozes come out to play once the mycoloth is finished eating.


Also for the deck i would highly recommend some Vines of the vastwood so you have a way to protect your mycoloths and vampires from things like doom blade and what-not.
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Executor Taelok » 04 Oct 2010, 15:03

Yaxley wrote:
Matt wrote:which mythic did you get?

-m

Some dude called Venser, the Sojourner. The thrill was lessened by the fact that I had no idea what a Planeswalker was or how they worked.


I really want to make a deck around Venser, but I don't think I can validate playing a 5 drop Venser just to blink a Titan when I can just play a Baneslayer or a other more effective 5 drops. His ultimate is pretty friggin' sweet, but then again, so are most planeswalker ultimates. That all said, I'm still going to play around with Venser because he is so cool!
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Cybren » 04 Oct 2010, 20:07

Was actually iffy on that myself and was looking for clarification, Rytel. I'll have ot settle for a +15/+15 bloodthrone with trample.

OR give it a grappling hook to give it double strike...
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Trymantha » 08 Oct 2010, 16:31

so im looking to make a new type 2 deck for fnm this friday but i dont know what to build, so what would people recomend?

the ideas are going through my mind are the following.
Monno red goblins.
infect(R/B or B/G).
mono black control.

any new ideas welcome.
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Xiryc » 08 Oct 2010, 20:34

If I were to try to make an infect deck, it would be B/U, to take advantage of Proliferate.

Man...I leave for Ohio State Champs in 5.5 hours. Gonna try to Elf my way to victory. At least I have my top hat and monocle!
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Trymantha » 09 Oct 2010, 13:48

Xiryc wrote:If I were to try to make an infect deck, it would be B/U, to take advantage of Proliferate.

Man...I leave for Ohio State Champs in 5.5 hours. Gonna try to Elf my way to victory. At least I have my top hat and monocle!



good luck at champs man hope the elf come through for you, im assuming elfdrazi deck?

any way i thought about a B/U infect but i just think proliferate is just to slow for my liking.
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Xiryc » 10 Oct 2010, 08:51

I ended up dropping at 3-3. I really think I would've done better if I had more time to test and whatnot. I kept a couple opening hands I shouldn't have, and my sideboard wasn't the best.

Then I played in a 3 hour plus EDH side event, where I killed two people and won 6 packs. The judges were all enjoying our game, which featured me using Rite of Replication with Kicker on another guy's Platinum Angel. Oh and at one point I took his Memnarch with Ray of Command and kept it with Memnarch's second ability.
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby MowDownJoe » 16 Oct 2010, 11:40

I hate still being in love with Magic and not having money to build a new deck. I've been playing the same SqueeLoamBind deck since... well, since those cards were in Standard. Still a fun deck, but everyone I know has kinda grown tired of it and want me to play something else.
...Ehh, maybe some kind of big mana deck? I think I still have Vesuvas, and Cloudposts and Glimmerposts are dirt cheap. I could make a crazy deck that abuses large amounts of colorless mana... but how? Hmm...
Did have a random brainstorm the other day about putting Grafted Exoskeleton on an Inferno Titan and swinging instantly for lethal poison, and tried to build a silly little red deck that was... well, a red deck, with Inferno Titan and Grafted Exoskeleton. Doubt I'll actually buy the cards for it, though, as they all seem a bit pricy. (Especially Koth... YOWZERS!)
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Drinnik » 20 Oct 2010, 08:34

I found my old Black and Green Deck from a few years ago. It's not great, but it won me a few games.

Creatures x20

The Encroaching Dead
Lord of the Undead
Bogwraith
Severed Legion
Scathe Zombies
Maggot Carrier
Ravenous Rats

Beasts
Enormous Baloth x 2
Spined Wurm
Rhox

Elves of the Forest
Wurmskin Forger
Wood Elves x 2
Vine Trellis

Animals of the Forest

Canopy Spider
Giant Badger
Lone Wolf
Spitting Spider

Other
Nantuko Disciple
Rushwood Dryad

Spells
Living Terrain
Serpent Skin
Giant Growth x 2
Fertile Ground
Rampant Growth
Regeneration
Stream of Life
Wing Snare
Monstrous Growth
Raise Dead
Sever Soul
Vicious Hunger

Artefact
Rod of Ruin

Land
Forest x 15
Swamp x 10

I do also have Tree of Tales and Okina, Temple to the Grandfathers, but have no reason to have them in my deck.
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Galadred » 26 Oct 2010, 10:21

Hey guys, first post :)

listening to the guys talk about it and the urging of a friend, I have started collecting magic cards, I have bought a starter deck and 6 boosters so far.

My deck at the moment is based on a starter deck, it is a black /green vampire based deck:

1x captivating vampire
1xRoyal assassin
4x Barony vampire
4x bloodthrone vampire
4x child of night
3x reassembling skeleton
1x black knight
1x Gravedigger
1x Greater Basilisk
3x Runeclaw bear
1x sylvan ranger

1x Sign in blood
3x rise from the grave
2x corrupt
1x blood tithe
2x giant growth
1x duress
2x diabolic tutor
2x Disentomb
2x Doom blade

7x Forest
13 x Swamp


Just wondering what you guys think as it is the first deck I've made.

Thanks
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Matt » 26 Oct 2010, 11:10

On Jer's Suggestion, (and based heavily on a deck list he built for me) I built a new mono-white deck. I'm very happy with it.

It includes:

4x Elite Vanguard
2x Stormfront Pegasus
4x Wall of Omens
2x Survival Cache
2x Brave the elements
2x Everflowing Chalice
2x Day of Judgement
3x Journey to Nowhere
2x Condemn
2x Luminarch Ascention
1x Shepherd of the Lost
4x Serra Angel
1x Sunblast Angel
1x Deathless Angel
1x Iona, Shield of Emeria
1x Linvala, Keeper of Silence
1x Admonition Angel
1x Baneslayer Angel
2x Emeria, the Sky Ruin
22x Plains

I'm considering swapping out the Shepherd of the lost for an Emeria Angel but I haven't pulled the trigger on that yet. The Emeria drags out all those birds, but the shepherd is a better straight up atk/blk.

This deck has been performing quite admirably, so far.

-m
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Cybren » 28 Oct 2010, 10:56

So here's my Slimey Vampires deck:
4x Llanowar Elves
2x Elves of Deep Shadow
4x Cultivate
4x Bloodthrone Vampire
4x Reassembling Skeleton
4x Mitotic Slime
1x Fists of Ironwood
2x Canopy Cover
4x Overwhelming Stampede
2x Snake Umbra
4x Giant Growth
1x Nim Deathmantle
2x Nature's Spiral
2x Disentomb
9x Forest
1x Oran-Rief, the Vastwood
6x Swamp
4x Savage Lands

The Sideboard contains
4x Naturalize
4x Doomblade
2x Leyline of Lifeforce
1x Leyline of Vitality
2x Asceticism
1x Jinxed Idol


THE PLAN is to get out the bloodthrone vampire and the slime, then have the vamp eat the slime, and all the little slimes, and all the littler slimes. THE METHOD is mana ramping with elves and cultivate. Snake Umbrae provides draw power and protection for my vamps, while canopy cover and fist of ironwood allow it to deal damage (need flyer to block canopy cover, and ironwood gives trample. as a bonus ironwood gives two saprolings the vampire can immediately eat). Nim Deathmantle does triple duty, giving my vampire intimidate, providing recursion for my slime (allowing me to double dip on a single mitotic slime in one turn), and giving me something say in a badass yu-gi-oh voice (this role is also shared by ORAN-RIEF, THE VASTWOOD). The Skeletons are awesome because they can keep me alive against big or small beaters indefinitely, and can be used to pump the vampire. Finally, overwhelming stampede comes into play as the most fun card in all of magic. So i have four elves, two vampires, and a slime. Four 1/1 elves, a 1/1 slime, and a slime becomes four 15/15 trample elves and a 30/30 trample vampire. Use as many giant growths as you have available in response to your own stampede, too, for added fun.
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Matt » 28 Oct 2010, 11:03

I'm pretty sure tokens exile when sac'd. They don't go to the graveyard.

so the act of eating the first wave of little slimes stops the tiny slimes from ocurring.

-m

edit: no actually, I guess I'm wrong.
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Cybren » 28 Oct 2010, 11:57

Tokens are gone once they hit the graveyard but the first slime ain't a token
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Matt » 28 Oct 2010, 12:10

yeah, I figured that out after making the post. They hit the graveyard then exile immediately.

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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Matt » 28 Oct 2010, 12:17

Oh balls.

I just found This.

I want to find a way to put it on this,

while this is in play.

:|

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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby ecocd » 28 Oct 2010, 14:05

Matt wrote:On Jer's Suggestion, (and based heavily on a deck list he built for me) I built a new mono-white deck. I'm very happy with it.

It includes:

4x Elite Vanguard
2x Stormfront Pegasus
4x Wall of Omens
2x Survival Cache
2x Brave the elements
2x Everflowing Chalice
2x Day of Judgement
3x Journey to Nowhere
2x Condemn
2x Luminarch Ascention
1x Shepherd of the Lost
4x Serra Angel
1x Sunblast Angel
1x Deathless Angel
1x Iona, Shield of Emeria
1x Linvala, Keeper of Silence
1x Admonition Angel
1x Baneslayer Angel
2x Emeria, the Sky Ruin
22x Plains

I'm considering swapping out the Shepherd of the lost for an Emeria Angel but I haven't pulled the trigger on that yet. The Emeria drags out all those birds, but the shepherd is a better straight up atk/blk.

This deck has been performing quite admirably, so far.

-m


Hey Matt,

I haven’t played since Invasion block (I’d say the Dark Ages, but that was the title of an actual set). Deck-building fundamentals pretty much don’t change so I feel comfortable giving some advice. I’m not sure how much you’re playing for power vs. fun, but there are a few choices that I would reconsider in the deck either way.

My first impression is that you’ve noticed the deck is a bit inconsistent. You’re occasionally staring at a hand with 2 Angels and 4 Plains on the board and a small army across from you smashing face OR you’re sitting with no cards in hand, a wall and two weenies praying to draw a fattie.

If you’re looking for more consistency, I think you’ll also want to refocus the deck. Consistent Magic decks are all about focus and you have to decide if you’re a control deck, aggro deck, aggro-control deck or combo deck. Once you’ve decided on the type of deck, you have to look at each and every card in your deck and explicitly justify how that card gets you to your goal.

There are a lot of “win more” cards in your deck right now. By that, I mean a card that may look really useful on its own, but in actual play is only really useful once you’re already winning. Survival Cache is a pretty classic example.

In the early game, if you’ve been lucky enough to get a weenie through to hit an opponent and you cast Survival Cache on turn 3, you’ve just spent an entire turn to draw an extra card next turn (the life gain is inconsequential because it’s early game).

In the late-game you’ve been fending off attackers for a few turns and there’s a fairly good chance you’re low on life – in this case you’re getting 4 life for 3 mana which is a pretty terrible card by every measure.

In the late-game if you do, in fact, have more life than your opponent, you’re already in control of the game. The life gain is worthless at this point so now you’re paying 3 mana to draw a card next turn. On the whole, the cards in your deck are more powerful than your opponent’s deck. You’re going to win the game, it’s just a matter of time. Would you rather draw an Angel this turn or spend 3 mana on a Survival Cache that helps you draw an Angel next turn? I’ll take the Angel this turn.

That’s the kind of thinking you want to be putting into a deck once you have the skeleton built like you do right now. Just ask yourself, “how does this card help me control the board?” Wall of Omens is fantastic in this deck. In the early game it stalls the board from almost every creature and it replaces itself so it’s not a wasted card. In the late game, it only costs you two mana to cycle it and there’s a chance you’ll have 7 mana so you’ll be able to drop that Serra you just drew off of it. It would be a decent card at 0/3. To get rid of it, your opponent is either going to be waiting until turn five when they have a monster that can kill it or they’re going to have to waste a spell (and possibly an attack) killing the wall. You’ve spent 0 cards and they spent 1 card (+ an attack). Control is ALL about card advantage and Wall of Omens is textbook card advantage. I bet that card is seeing a ton of play if control is at all viable.

I could write another 5 paragraphs, I think, but I’ll leave you with a few much shorter pieces of advice.

If you’re playing control, you need 4 Day of Judgement. No way around it. How often are you disappointed to draw it? Almost never. That means you play 4. If you’re allow to play Wrath of God, you’d even want four of those (you probably don’t even want to play mono-white control without 8 board sweepers). In that vein, Condemn and Journey to Nowhere are more valuable than Stormfront Pegasus. Drop the flying horses.

You might want to re-evaluate your finishers. Iona is another “win more” card. At 9 mana, you should’ve already won the game, anyway. Her ability is just stupid that late in the game. You really want to focus on “I win” cards like Deathless Angel and Sunblast Angel (and Baneslayer, obviously, but mythic rares were a HUGE money grab. FU WotC). A good control deck shouldn’t really be playing much more than 6 finishers, but you can go up to 8 if you just like smashing face with angels.

The manabase is great and I don’t think I’d change a thing. I think I like Everflowing Chalice. Since you’re playing a mono color deck, the colorless mana part doesn’t matter and at 2 mana, it accelerates you to the all-important 4 mana plateau. At 4 mana, if you don’t have to clear the board immediately, it accelerates you to 6 mana for your angels. I would suggest trying 22 Plains, 4 Chalices and dropping the Emerias (kind of a “win more” card).

I wish I had enough money to play Magic again.
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Matt » 28 Oct 2010, 14:35

thanks for the advice, ecocd!

I'm gonna toss out a little more info here for you, not to rebut, but just for the sake of information:

The design philosophy for this deck was "how do we get a serra out by turn 4?"

Result:

Turn 1: 1 plain, elite vanguard.
Turn 2: 1 plain, Wall of omens, draw.
Turn 3: 1 plains chalice, one counter, another wall/vanguard/Luminarch ascention/DoJ/save the mana for a response play (depending on the hand).
Turn 4: Plains, serra.

So far, this deck has been acomplishing the above, or similar, like near clockwork.

The survival caches are in for early-game spare cards because they're 3 mana for 2 cards, and have proven effective in accomplishing just that in play-test so far. They're not handy every game, and if I draw them late or am hurting when I get them they're a bit weak, but they're solid for getting cards into my hand fast early on. These were the cards Jer identified as possible take or leave cards as well, but they've been quite useful so far.

The bulk of the deck's success so far has honestly centred around the luminarch ascension. Between the decks seeming unwillingness to mana drought (on thursaday I played several games and never once had less than 9 mana on the field at the end of the game [highest output was 21]) and the deck's ability to defend itself through the first 5 or six turns with relative ease, that luminarch ascension becomes a ludicrously powerful card, belting out 4-5 angels a turn.

The only games I've lost of late have been the ones that killed that card, or managed to do direct damage to me consistently.

On the DoJ topic: I'm actually finding the DoJ to be only somewhat useful. The original plan called for 3, but I scaled that back to 2, because they weren't proving useful. The deck hammers out big guns so fast, and so regularly, and in such numbers that there's rarely ever an advantage to be gained by playing them. They've been of more use to get rid of creatures with white protection than they have been for clearing the board to get a finisher out. Whenever I draw both DoJ's the second one almost never hits the field.

The finisher angels are there mostly for spice. (Though the deathless is AMAZING, I <3 it.) They're just there to be big scary angels, and the abilities are mostly there for fun. The deck more frequently hammers out 10 4/4 angel tokens and a pair of serras than it does get the finishers out.

I'm disnclined to drop these cards (they're my theme, after all!), but the variety is, admittedly, coming at the expense of a single endgame focus (like baneslayers and deathless angels). Still though, every one is useful every time it does find its way into play.

The emirias have only ever proven useful once, but holy hell did they save my ass.

Cheers though! I really appreciate the insight.

-m
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby RytelCSF » 28 Oct 2010, 14:51

ecocd wrote:You have to look at each and every card in your deck and explicitly justify how that card gets you to your goal.


I can't play Myr Battlesphere just because it's a friggin' katamari?

I can't play Hex because despite it being worthless in duels and not too great in multiplayer, it's an absolute beating the rare moment it actually works?

I can't play Stitch in Time because half the time it does absolutely nothing for three mana and a card?

I can't play Riptide Replicator just because its wording allows me to roll a d20 to determine what silly/ridiculous creature type I'm churning out huge/huge tokens of?

I can't play Sedraxis Alchemist and Parasitic Strix just because their synergy allows me to imagine them as partners in some sort of bizarre buddy cop movie?

Not everyone plays Magic for tournament glory.
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Re: Magic: The Gathering: Whatcha mean, there's no thread yet?

Postby Matt » 28 Oct 2010, 14:56

To be fair, the myr battlesphere is a pretty good card in the right deck.

-m
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