The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

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chetoos
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby chetoos » 30 Dec 2014, 10:26

steric hindrance wrote:The Modern version seems pretty slow against the current metagame. I'd focus on having a lot more cantrips to trigger the Skulker instead of the creature-based engine (which doesn't have enough ETB effects or a toolbox to really abuse Pod).

Perhaps something like:
Click to Expand
3 Chasm Skulker
4 Lotus Cobra (if too pricey, substitute Sakura-Tribe Elder)
1 Consecrated Sphinx
4 Delver of Secrets
3 Remand (if too pricey, use Mana Leak)
3 Deprive
4 Serum Visions (hard to replace, but I could see a mix of other spells like Quicken, Sleight of Hand, or Jace Beleren working out)
4 Thought Scour
4 Treasure Cruise
3 Explore
3 Gitaxian Probe (If too pricey, substitute Peek)
4 Vapor Snag

4 Breeding Pool
4 Misty Rainforest (if fetches are too pricey, use basic lands)
2 Windswept Heath
2 Flooded Strand
4 Island
3 Forest
1 Reliquary Tower

I like this idea, and maybe one of the serum visions could be a nylea's presence. It cantrips, and I like to use it offensively to turn their land into an island for maximum squid value.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby steric hindrance » 30 Dec 2014, 10:56

chetoos wrote:
steric hindrance wrote:The Modern version seems pretty slow against the current metagame. I'd focus on having a lot more cantrips to trigger the Skulker instead of the creature-based engine (which doesn't have enough ETB effects or a toolbox to really abuse Pod).

Perhaps something like:
Click to Expand
3 Chasm Skulker
4 Lotus Cobra (if too pricey, substitute Sakura-Tribe Elder)
1 Consecrated Sphinx
4 Delver of Secrets
3 Remand (if too pricey, use Mana Leak)
3 Deprive
4 Serum Visions (hard to replace, but I could see a mix of other spells like Quicken, Sleight of Hand, or Jace Beleren working out)
4 Thought Scour
4 Treasure Cruise
3 Explore
3 Gitaxian Probe (If too pricey, substitute Peek)
4 Vapor Snag

4 Breeding Pool
4 Misty Rainforest (if fetches are too pricey, use basic lands)
2 Windswept Heath
2 Flooded Strand
4 Island
3 Forest
1 Reliquary Tower

I like this idea, and maybe one of the serum visions could be a nylea's presence. It cantrips, and I like to use it offensively to turn their land into an island for maximum squid value.

There's the always hilarious Spreading Seas to punish greedy mana bases, too.
chetoos
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby chetoos » 30 Dec 2014, 11:30

steric hindrance wrote:
chetoos wrote:
steric hindrance wrote:The Modern version seems pretty slow against the current metagame. I'd focus on having a lot more cantrips to trigger the Skulker instead of the creature-based engine (which doesn't have enough ETB effects or a toolbox to really abuse Pod).

Perhaps something like:
Click to Expand
3 Chasm Skulker
4 Lotus Cobra (if too pricey, substitute Sakura-Tribe Elder)
1 Consecrated Sphinx
4 Delver of Secrets
3 Remand (if too pricey, use Mana Leak)
3 Deprive
4 Serum Visions (hard to replace, but I could see a mix of other spells like Quicken, Sleight of Hand, or Jace Beleren working out)
4 Thought Scour
4 Treasure Cruise
3 Explore
3 Gitaxian Probe (If too pricey, substitute Peek)
4 Vapor Snag

4 Breeding Pool
4 Misty Rainforest (if fetches are too pricey, use basic lands)
2 Windswept Heath
2 Flooded Strand
4 Island
3 Forest
1 Reliquary Tower

I like this idea, and maybe one of the serum visions could be a nylea's presence. It cantrips, and I like to use it offensively to turn their land into an island for maximum squid value.

There's the always hilarious Spreading Seas to punish greedy mana bases, too.

I didn't know about that one. Bonus points if they don't play blue
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby Tinfish » 12 Jan 2015, 17:53

So what clan do you intend to pick for the Fate Reforged prerelease? I kinda want to go Temur this time (I went Mardu last time and did pretty well with it) but I'd also be happy with Abzan or Sultai. Anything with green in it I guess?
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby BarcodeReader » 12 Jan 2015, 18:34

If I end up going, I'll probably go Jeskai.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby Antitonic » 13 Jan 2015, 14:26

I managed to get both days off work, and it'll be my first prerelease since New Phyrexia. If they let me, I'll go Temur, Abzan, Mardu in that order (Friday midnight event, Saturday, Sunday). Otherwise, Abzan's my top pick.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby SohNata » 14 Jan 2015, 16:25

I think Jeskai one day, Sultai the other.

Also, stolen from the MTG Subreddit, but this Tumblr of horrendously designed MTG fan cards is full of hilarity.

http://whymtgcardsmith.tumblr.com/

This is my current 'winner' from it:

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Um...
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby Can't Wear Hats » 14 Jan 2015, 16:44

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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby SohNata » 14 Jan 2015, 16:52

There are so many worse ones in there. But that one I just like for how every single ability contradicts each other somehow.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby Antitonic » 14 Jan 2015, 16:55

So, creature type Dragon Human?
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby SohNata » 14 Jan 2015, 16:59

Antitonic wrote:So, creature type Dragon Human?


Exactly! Then you can block with that and it get's destroyed!

Except for the fact it's Indestructible.

I've seen a couple cards where it makes tokens with Undying.

:|

I want to paste in so many, but seriously - just read the archive. It's glorious.

Okay. One other.

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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby phlip » 14 Jan 2015, 17:22

OK, good to know that if I ever actually make any of the cards in my Rules Lawyer Troll Set, they also need to be misspelled and have horrible grammar...

Click to Expand
The Rules Lawyer Troll Set current contents:

Code: Select all

What now? - 1U
Creature - Enigma
2/1
~ loses all abilities.

Code: Select all

Floor Fans - 3U
Enchantment
Creatures with power 2 or less have flying.

Code: Select all

Firing Squad - 3R
Creature - Goblin
1/1
When ~ enters the battlefield, it deals 1 damage to target creature or player.
Storm.

Code: Select all

Again! Again, again! - 3U
Instant
Target instant or sorcery spell you control gains Epic.

Code: Select all

One at a time, please - 4UU
World Enchantment
All permanents are legendary.

Code: Select all

Counter-ring - 1WU
Enchantment
[edit]Flash[/edit]
When ~ enters the battlefield, exile target spell.
When ~ leaves the battlefield, the exiled card's owner may cast it without paying its mana cost.

Code: Select all

Maro's Nightmare - XXGG
Instant
Exile X target creatures or spells
Last edited by phlip on 14 Jan 2015, 19:40, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby AdmiralMemo » 14 Jan 2015, 17:33

Question: Is the "destroy it" part of the ability meaning "destroy Smaug" or "destroy the Human"?

The only three ways I can see of this even coming up are:
1. Blocked by a Changeling, Misform Ultimus, or a creature equipped with a Runed Stalactite, so the creature is all creature types.
2. A "Mistform" creature activated twice to be a Human and a Dragon.
3. Some sort of Human/Dragon combo from Xenograft.

Even not considering the contradictory abilities, it's still a way-overcosted card that I wouldn't play.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby phlip » 14 Jan 2015, 17:44

"Overcosted" is certainly a running theme on this thing...

That is, when things aren't marginally undercosted...
While no one overhear you quickly tell me not cow cow.
but how about watch phone?

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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby korvys » 14 Jan 2015, 17:57

phlip wrote:OK, good to know that if I ever actually make any of the cards in my Rules Lawyer Troll Set, they also need to be misspelled and have horrible grammar...

Click to Expand
The Rules Lawyer Troll Set current contents:

Code: Select all

What now? - 1U
Creature - Enigma
2/1
~ loses all abilities.

Code: Select all

Floor Fans - 3U
Enchantment
Creatures with power 2 or less have flying.

Code: Select all

Firing Squad - 3R
Creature - Goblin
1/1
When ~ enters the battlefield, it deals 1 damage to target creature or player.
Storm.

Code: Select all

Again! Again, again! - 3U
Instant
Target instant or sorcery spell you control gains Epic.

Code: Select all

One at a time, please - 4UU
World Enchantment
All permanents are legendary.

Code: Select all

Counter-ring - 1WU
Enchantment
When ~ enters the battlefield, exile target spell.
When ~ leaves the battlefield, the exiled card's owner may cast it without paying its mana cost.

Code: Select all

Maro's Nightmare - XXGG
Instant
Exile X target creatures or spells

phlip you monster. These seem perfect for nerd sniping judges.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby phlip » 14 Jan 2015, 18:12

The "Floor Fans" one is my favourite, since it's so arcane what the actual problem is...
While no one overhear you quickly tell me not cow cow.
but how about watch phone?

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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby korvys » 14 Jan 2015, 18:32

Unless I'm missing something, it's fine, it just becomes super counter-intuitive that if you pump a creature, it doesn't lose flying.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby Can't Wear Hats » 14 Jan 2015, 18:32

phlip wrote:The "Floor Fans" one is my favourite, since it's so arcane what the actual problem is...


On the other end of the scale, a creature token with undying is so beautifully dumb.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby AdmiralMemo » 14 Jan 2015, 18:52

I think I see the problems with most of them... Let me see if I got them right...

What now? <- Ability removes itself.
Floor Fans <- No clue.
Firing Squad <- Creature with Storm?
Again! Again, again! <- Instants can't have Epic?
One at a time, please <- Say goodbye to your mana base. (Not sure how it's a rules problem, but just seems bad.)
Counter-ring <- Needs Flash to actually work.
Maro's Nightmare <- No clue.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby VectorZero » 14 Jan 2015, 19:30

"Templating. Grammar. A Cardsmith craves not these things."
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby phlip » 14 Jan 2015, 19:34

AdmiralMemo wrote:What now? <- Ability removes itself.

Technically, it actually doesn't, but it looks like it should... it's a little weird.

But basically it's the Opalesence/Humility judge-brainteaser in a single card (if you play two Opalesences and a Humility, then the Opalesences make each other creatures, so Humility should remove their abilities, but then they shouldn't be creatures any more???). The rules have a resolution in there for it (once an ability has started to apply to things, removing that ability doesn't have any effect), but it does tend to stump people who aren't that familiar with the rules.
AdmiralMemo wrote:Floor Fans <- No clue.

The rules have this system in place to control what order different continuous effects apply, colloquially called the layer system. It's set up so that if you ever have something in one layer that depends on another layer, it all works how you expect (say, if you have a bear and Favorable Winds, and you Jump the bear, it goes from being a 2/2 on the ground to a 3/3 in the air, as the Winds now apply... which works because Abilities are in an earlier layer to Power/Toughness). On the other hand, if you're dependent on something in a later layer, the whole thing falls down... so they just never print cards that are dependent in the wrong order.

That's the way that Floor Fans works... it checks the power of the creature to determine whether to give it flying before any P/T-changing effects are applied. So if you have a bear, it'll have flying, and even if you Giant Growth it, it won't lose flying. While your 3/3 won't gain flying even if you put a -1/-1 counter on it. Clones will still care if the power of the thing they're copying is 2 or less, because copy is an earlier layer, but eg Tarmogoyf will always have flying no matter how big it gets, as even characteristic-defining P/T abilities get done in the other order.
AdmiralMemo wrote:Firing Squad <- Creature with Storm?

There's no way to copy a permanent spell with cards that already exist, and there's no rules to handle it. If they ever wanted to, they could add a rule that says, say, that a copy of a permanent spell creates a token on resolution, or something, but that doesn't exist right now. So say you cast Firing Squad as the fifth spell of the turn. You get your real creature spell, and 4 copies. They all resolve, and you get to deal 5 damage to things... but then all the copies are now copies of a spell outside the stack, and disappear (in the same way a token disappears when it leaves the battlefield - you still get your dies trigger or whatever and then it's gone) and you're left with a single 1/1.
AdmiralMemo wrote:Again! Again, again! <- Instants can't have Epic?

They can. There's nothing rules-wrong with this one, I just think it would result in a lot of judge calls. Honestly, the previous version was probably a lot better as a troll-set card, as it was missing the words "you control"... Kappa
AdmiralMemo wrote:One at a time, please <- Say goodbye to your mana base. (Not sure how it's a rules problem, but just seems bad.)

Again, more of a general troll card than a rules troll card... especially given Leyline of Singularity is a card that exists... people will miss that it doesn't say "non-land" at first.
AdmiralMemo wrote:Counter-ring <- Needs Flash to actually work.

Oops, typo on my part... the one in my notes does have Flash.
Honestly, I think this one is just a cool card, but it does have a number of kinda weird interactions.
AdmiralMemo wrote:Maro's Nightmare <- No clue.

Mark Rosewater really loves his colour pie, and hates cards that break it. Green spells that can directly kill creatures are one of his pet peeves (search for his opinion on Hornet Sting sometime). The "or spells" part is in there just as the icing on the cake.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby korvys » 14 Jan 2015, 19:47

AdmiralMemo wrote:I think I see the problems with most of them... Let me see if I got them right...

What now? <- Ability removes itself.
Floor Fans <- No clue.
Firing Squad <- Creature with Storm?
Again! Again, again! <- Instants can't have Epic?
One at a time, please <- Say goodbye to your mana base. (Not sure how it's a rules problem, but just seems bad.)
Counter-ring <- Needs Flash to actually work.
Maro's Nightmare <- No clue.


If I understand things correctly, and I probably don't:

What now?:
It-

I just nerd-sniped myself, I've been staring at this for 5 minutes now. The ability is dependent on itself, which means we have to apply it before we apply it...


Floor Fans:
See above. Layers make it weird, but it unlike What Now, it still works.

Firing Squad:
There's nothing in the rules about creatures with storm. In fact, the storm part would probably work fine, as it's a triggered ability that triggers on casting. You just make lots of copies of the creature spell. However, there aren't any rules on how creature spell copies should resolve.

Again! Again, again!:
This would work exactly how you'd expect. Spell gets epic. When it resolves, stops you casting any more spells, and sets up a delayed triggered ability for every upkeep to copy the spell in question. Nothing stops instants having epic.

One at a time, please:
Works just like Layline of Singularity, only it affects lands.

Counter-ring:
Would work fine, if it had flash.

Maro's Nightmare.
Works fine, but Maro would have a fit if this was printed in green.


EDIT: phlip has explained it, but I'm posting my post anyway.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby Quixotep » 14 Jan 2015, 21:28

SohNata, think you for bringing this site to my attention. I've been cracking up for 20 minutes.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby Atifexe » 15 Jan 2015, 02:17

So it occurs to me that as of Fate Reforged, we can now Manifest (Figure of) Destiny.
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Re: The General Magic: The Gathering Thread

Postby ElFuzzy » 15 Jan 2015, 21:03

So will anyone join me in calling Reality Shift Bloom Blade? It's a better blue doom blade that blossoms life from another's destruction.

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