Let's make a LRR block

[korvys]

Kapol had a kickstarter card, which was very close to one I made a while back as well. You just have an ability on an enchantment that anyone can play, and that benefits everyone.

Also, this needs to go in there somewhere:

[Kapol]

Kapol had a kickstarter card, which was very close to one I made a while back as well. You just have an ability on an enchantment that anyone can play, and that benefits everyone.

Also, this needs to go in there somewhere:

Mine wasn't quite group-hug as it only hit your stuff, but that could be an idea to work off. Though I added the draw thing as a kind of threat for the game (you're close to winning, and your opponent puts on enough counters to make the game draw).

As for that card... I feel that's a bit too silly. However, I feel like it could be put in if there'll be a mechanic that allows both options to be chosen. Kind of like kicker. So 1R choose one, or... 2RR choose both (like how he realized he could run both of them).

[korvys]

The thing is, it's completely balanced, it's functional, it's templated correctly, it's a joke, and in a kind of meta joke it provides another functional reprint of that card.

[susu.exp]

A fair point, but I don't think we should go looking for rules to break unless there's a good reason to do so. I mean, if you've got a card that is kinda clunky, or doesn't feel right, maybe it's time to break some rules, or maybe it's time to drop the idea, or re-work it.

Sure. I don't want to put something crazy in the set just to put something crazy in the set. But at this point we're looking for ideas and I don't want somebody not to post theirs because they think it might not work. If there's an idea for a LRR related mechanic and it's out there, but hits in terms of flavor, it might be worth trying to make it work. I think they spent an age trying to template overload for instance - pay an extra cost and it copies the spell for all legal targets is clunky, but the final version is easy to grok and works.

The impression I have from RnD is that somebody will come up with an idea. This will first hit Rosewater, who will work it until it fits the color pie (apparently the other designers try to smuggle color pie violations past him). Then it will hit development where it might go the way of the dodo. And then it has to get past Tabak.
If the idea is cool it'll go through interations until it passes all of this. But the original pool of ideas can be rather big and in fact has to be so that there's something left after all these filters.

For the shows = decks thing, I think it's a good idea, as it allows you to say "I'm playing my Unskippable/Crapshots deck" or something, which is awesome to be able to say. But that doesn't mean you need to make cards with mechanics with show names, just that cards that are referencing a certain show should all play into a theme, like the aforementioned B/R Crapshots aggro deck, cause it's about being quick. Haste creatures and burn.

It's more of a development issue though.

[tamaness]

I don't want to put something crazy in the set just to put something crazy in the set. But at this point we're looking for ideas and I don't want somebody not to post theirs because they think it might not work. If there's an idea for a LRR related mechanic and it's out there, but hits in terms of flavor, it might be worth trying to make it work. I think they spent an age trying to template overload for instance - pay an extra cost and it copies the spell for all legal targets is clunky, but the final version is easy to grok and works.

I'm glad to work on templating for mechanics that don't quite work. If anyone's got something, by all means, put it out there. We can work on it until it works, and if it doesn't, then as long as we've got enough mechanics, then we can leave it for a future project.

[My pseudonym is Ix]

See, I really, really like this- it's a simple, obvious joke that allows the card to function as a card whilst still providing random entertainment value. Gives the set a bit more humour value.

Kickstarter
1GG (green due to it's base in community, not sure about cost)
(Legendary?) Enchantment
X: Put X Fund counters on Kickstarter. Any player may activate this ability.
If there are five or more Fund counters on Kickstarter, creatures you control have +1/+1. If there are ten or more Fund counters on Kickstarter, creatures you control have Trample. If there are twenty or more Fund counters on Kickstarter, creatures you control have hexproof. If there are fifty or more fund counters on Kickstarter, creatures you control have +10/+10. (Too much text? Might need to bring it down to some slimmer abilities. Also, not sure if there should be a higher end. Maybe something like 100 counters to make the game end in a draw?)
(Add in an extra ability? I'm thinking something like "At the beginning of your upkeep, remove a fund counter from Kickstarter" to signify spending some of the kickstarter money.

Also like this, if only because a friend of mine has a grouphug commander deck that this would be just AMAZING in. I think it works as is without the 'remove a fund counter' business, in part because spending KS money doesn't happen until after the KS is over- this whole card feels like it is perpetually in the money-raising stakes. If you wanted, though, we could have another card, 'Spender' or something, which can remove fund counters from other cards in order to do... things. Means that even if it is grouphuggy in nature, the person playing it could still use it aggressively in combination

Affecting the play cost is pretty much the trap mechanic, which isn't bad. Just giving things flash seems interesting - you could have things like

CARDNAME
U
Sorcery
Counter target spell
Unskippable - if your opponent played 2 or more spells this turn CARDNAME gains flash.

Good point- that way it allows the creation of cheap, otherwise semi-useless cards that can be exploited to quite devastating effect when used properly. I think including a fair few 'draw' commons with Unskippable would work well in this respect (e.g. Cardname/W/Enchantment/Target creature gains "Tap: Draw two cards", Unskippable if your opponent played an instant this turn)- otherwise such a glut of cheap cards could empty one's hand quite quickly, and this would also make the deck quite fun & unpredictable, with you drawing card after card in the hope of finding something else Unskippable to counter what your opponent is trying to do. It probably wouldn't work a lot of the time, but would be entertaining as hell.

[Firbozz]

I really like the idea of shows = deck archetypes. This has the benefit of giving what cards we want in each colour and at each rarity some structure.

[ElFuzzy]

So at time of writing Snorsh it big in checkpoint, maybe get a snorsh or LRRstotksa land?

[susu.exp]

Let's see if Snorsh sticks.

I put Alexes Choice in the cardfile for now.

Right now we are looking at common:

CW01 - Creature - small - Flungebird
CW02 - Creature - small -
CW03 - Creature - small -
CW04 - Creature - small -
CW05 - Creature - small -
CW06 - Creature - small -
CW07 - Creature - small -
CW08 - Creature - small -
CW09 - Creature - medium -
CW10 - Creature - medium -
CW11 - Creature - medium -
CW12 - Creature - medium -
CW13 - Instant - - Courage of Bricks
CW14 - - -
CW15 - - -
CW16 - - -
CW17 - - -
CW18 - - -
CW19 - - -
CU01 - Creature - small - Flungecat
CU02 - Creature - small -
CU03 - Creature - small -
CU04 - Creature - small -
CU05 - Creature - medium -
CU06 - Creature - large -
CU07 - Creature - large -
CU08 - - -
CU09 - - -
CU10 - - -
CU11 - - -
CU12 - - -
CU13 - - -
CU14 - - -
CU15 - - -
CU16 - - -
CU17 - - -
CU18 - - -
CU19 - - -
CB01 - Creature - small - Flungezombie
CB02 - Creature - small -
CB03 - Creature - small -
CB04 - Creature - small -
CB05 - Creature - small -
CB06 - Creature - medium -
CB07 - Creature - medium -
CB08 - Creature - medium -
CB09 - - -
CB10 - - -
CB11 - - -
CB12 - - -
CB13 - - -
CB14 - - -
CB15 - - -
CB16 - - -
CB17 - - -
CB18 - - -
CB19 - - -
CR01 - Creature - small - Flungegoblin
CR02 - Creature - small -
CR03 - Creature - small -
CR04 - Creature - small -
CR05 - Creature - small -
CR06 - Creature - small -
CR07 - Creature - medium -
CR08 - Creature - medium -
CR09 - Instant - Burn - Crapshot
CR10 - - -
CR11 - - -
CR12 - - -
CR13 - - -
CR14 - Sorcery - token making - Alex’s Choice
CR15 - - -
CR16 - - -
CR17 - - -
CR18 - - -
CR19 - - -
CG01 - Creature - small - Flungebear
CG02 - Creature - small -
CG03 - Creature - small -
CG04 - Creature - small -
CG05 - Creature - medium -
CG06 - Creature - medium -
CG07 - Creature - medium -
CG08 - Creature - medium -
CG09 - Creature - medium -
CG10 - Creature - large -
CG11 - Creature - large -
CG12 - - -
CG13 - - -
CG14 - - -
CG15 - - -
CG16 - - -
CG17 - - -
CG18 - - -
CG19 - - -
CA01 - - -
CA02 - - -
CA03 - - -
CA04 - - -
CA05 - - -
CA06 - - -

Including 6 Artifacts and changing creature ratios to make room for them (taking a spell out of WG, taking a creature out of the others) and using a creature slot for Alex's Choice.

I've tenatively left the Flungers in, let's see how it fills out.

[chetoos]

Question: Which video is Alex's Choice a reference to?

[steric hindrance]

Question: Which video is Alex's Choice a reference to?

The first Hero's Path video.

I think we could include Mr. Ballsmotron as an artifact with some top-down designed abilities.

[My pseudonym is Ix]

Now, at least the first of these may be a bit too silly to get included, but I thought of them in the shower today and they made me laugh:

Arstotska Border Guard
2WB
Creature
When Arstotska Border Guard attacks, all players must speak in a Russian accent until defender's end step. Any player who fails to do so must exile a creature. If the attacker fails to do so, exile Arstotska Border Guard.
3/2

Quantum Documentary
5WW
Sorcery
Target opponent [/all opponents/every player if we want maximum chaos] picks up the last five cards they played. They must play all of those cards again in the order they were originally played before playing any other cards.

Thoughts?

[susu.exp]

The Border Guard is very un-setty.

The documentary doesn't seem to be doing something you would want to do - it gets your opponent spells back and in most cases you don't want to do that. It does prevent land drops, which could be an issue and even worse, if they had a conditional counterspell in these 5, you can effectively keep them from ever playing another spell.
Then there are exile effects to consider - do exiled cards come back?

[My pseudonym is Ix]

Damned if I know, just thought they were interesting ideas that somebody with more MtG imagination than me could do something with.

[chetoos]

Redo of the Arstotskan Border Guard:
Arstotskan Border Guard (Figure out mana cost later)
Enters the battlefield tapped, doesn't untap during your untap step
At the beginning of each end step, you may pay 3. If you do, untap CARDNAME. If you do not pay the mana, tap it instead.
If CARDNAME is untapped, players must pay 4 mana for each creature attacking you or planeswalkers you control.
3/2

[My pseudonym is Ix]

To me, that satisfies the 'border guard' but not the 'Arstotska'. Whilst an interesting card concept, there's nothing inherently entertaining about it- nothing wrong with that, but still... we are making a set about a comedy troupe, after all.

[susu.exp]

Damned if I know, just thought they were interesting ideas that somebody with more MtG imagination than me could do something with.

Hmm, I think the documentary could work if it was a bounce spell, that allowed your opponent to take a card from their graveyard for each target beyond the first. Still needs some templating, but I think as it is it's a fell bad card. Either it gives upside to the targeted player and you don't want to cast it, or it completely wrecks their game. But it's not a game ender - you end up with a couple of turns where one side gets to play Magic and the other doesn't.

The reason I thought the Border-Guard is un-setty is that the mechanic is similar to "Gotcha!" from Unhinged. The mechanical idea is that players would declare attackers with a russian accent, the same for blockers and anything else in the combat phase. The problem is that this is not how it would get played. Gotcha had cards that triggered whenever you said a particular word or performed some action. And these were of course words people would tend to say while playing magic. "Swing with my guys." "Gotcha! This guy comes back from my graveyard." The result was that people would simply not talk during gameplay. It was a mechanic that made unhinged less fun to play with than it would have been otherwise.

So while Arstotska as written says "speak in a Russian accent", it translates into "don't speak" in actual gameplay.

And again, keep coming up with ideas. Not all of them will make it, but that's just how design works - kill your darlings et al.

How about giving all 2/2s for 2 the bear subtype (irrespective of other types).
So
Landshark troupe
1W
Creature - Human Fish Bear
T:CARDNAME fights target Bear
2/2

A stream mechanic:

Stream [cost] - You may exile CARDNAME from your hand. You may play cards exiled this way for their stream cost.

CARDNAME
G
Instant
Target Creature gains +2/+2 and reach until the end of turn
Stream 4GG

[chetoos]

Stream cards, once exiled, can be cast at any time, without going to the graveyard... That sounds like a good idea.
Cardname 1w
Instant
creatures you control get +1/+1 until end of turn
Stream 2WW

[korvys]

Hmmm, that's really good. The mechanic fit well with the flavour, and it gives you an interesting decision. There's a lot of design space around it as well. If an effect stacks (+1/+1, etc), the difference between the casting cost and the stream cost would have to be high, while if it doesn't (like, creatures you control gain vigilance or something similar) you could have the costs be quite close together.

The templating (which would be mostly hidden by the keyword) would probably have to be something like:
Exile CARDNAME from your hand: It gains "[COST]: You may copy CARDNAME. If you do, you may cast the copy without paying it's mana cost."

Ix: If the mechanics work, you can always try to get the humour from the flavour text and art. Stopping creatures attacking, and being dysfunctional about about it is pretty close, though a bit clunky with all the tapping and untapping.

Perhaps:
Arstotskan Border Guard - 3UW
1/4 - Human Soldier
Creatures can't attack you unless their controller pays 2 for each creature he or she controls that's attacking you.
(A literal cross between Border Guard and Propaganda)

Or possibly:
Arstotskan Border Guard - 2WW
1/4 - Human Soldier
At the beginning of your upkeep, sacrifice Arstotskan Border Guard unless you discard a card.
Creatures without flying can't attack.
(Basically a Moat with a drawback (cause Moat is busted))

[Volafortis]

Bad Salesman - 1B
Creature - Human
Uncommon

1B, Pay 3 life: You and target opponent search your library for a card. Shuffle your library. Put one of those cards at random into your hand, and the other on the bottom of your library.

1/2

---------

Axe Hand - 3R
Creature - Human Artificer
Common

First Strike
4/2

[tamaness]

I think the ability would be templated like so:
Stream X
[Whenever you could cast this spell, you may exile it from your hand instead. If you do, it gains 'X: cast a copy of this spell' for as long as it remains exiled this way.]

Stream Giant Growth
G
Instant
Stream GG
Target creature gets +3/+3. If CARDNAME was cast as a copy, target creature gets +5/+5 instead.

It also interacts well with effects like Mirari and Isochron Scepter this way.

[korvys]

Hmmm, yeah, that templating might be better. I think you still need to create the copy THEN cast the copy, based on the templating for things like Isocron Scepter.

I also think I prefer keeping the spell effect the same. It makes for a more interesting decision. Do you want to give up the efficiency for (virtual) card advantage?
GG for a giant growth isn't great, but when it doesn't cost a card, it's suddenly a lot more appealing.
I'm not sure tweaking the effect when Streamed is worth the card space when you can balance it using the cost. And the cost has a lot of flexibility too. 1G is pretty easy to use repeatably. GG drammatically less so. You're probably only using that once or twice a turn.

In any case, I think it's a great mechanic, and that's all development talk, not design talk. It's flavourful, matches what it's representing pretty well, and is pretty simple, so there's a lot of cool things we could do with it even at common. I might throw some cards out later.

[chetoos]

I had an idea for another mechanic: Loading Time. I think it's going to be something templated like this: Cost: Discard this card and put a token on the battlefield under your control that's a copy of target creature you control with the same mana cost as this creature, except it retains this creature's subtypes.
This kind of refers to the fact that the loading times are similar, but different, to the actual sketches, and works for a good mechanic.

[AdmiralMemo]

Chetoos: Just to clarify this interaction to make sure I understand...

If you had a Yoked Ox in play, and say Favored Hoplite had this "Loading Time" mechanic, the new token would have:
Name: Yoked Ox
CC: W
Type: Creature - Human Soldier
P/T: 0/4

Is this how you envisioned this, with the only thing changing about the token copy being the creature type?

[My pseudonym is Ix]

So, if the Unskippable and Stream mechanics are go (I like the mechanics of Stream and there's lots of potential to have fun with the naming/flavour of included cards given the variety of streams, so I'll go for it), I reckon we can fit about one more major mechanic in before the set starts becoming bloated & unwieldy. However, given I've only seen one set come & go during my time playing Magic I'm not sure of this- can someone clarify for me?

Anyway, point being we may have to try and fit references to the other shows in without building mechanics around them. Any ideas?

Not sure about that 'Loading Time' mechanic- it seems incredibly subtle and has the potential to work beautifully, but only if your deck functions perfectly and your opponent doesn't do anything inconvenient like counter your spells.x

However, I had a very vague idea for something else- a Feed Dump mechanic that grants bonuses when artifacts are equipped to a creature. How is this flavourful? Why, we just stuff the deck with 'This Hat' artifacts