Inside D&D 4th Edition

Talk about the latest LRR video or discuss your past favorites.
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Yukikaze
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Postby Yukikaze » 27 Jul 2008, 07:03

I find it amusing that someone with a signature decrying uniformity would be so resistant to natural change and mutation of a gaming system. In my eyes, DnD 3.5 has become bloated, a playground for rules lawyers and munchkins. A grand unified system would be good for the game.

Personally, I'm a fan of Big Eyes Small Mouth. It's simple, versatile, fast, only uses the D6, and it all comes in one book.
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Lyinginbedmon
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Postby Lyinginbedmon » 27 Jul 2008, 07:17

4E is definitely a mutation of D&D.


In the same way leukemia and birth defects are mutations.
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Tetsubo
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Postby Tetsubo » 27 Jul 2008, 08:28

Yukikaze wrote:I find it amusing that someone with a signature decrying uniformity would be so resistant to natural change and mutation of a gaming system. In my eyes, DnD 3.5 has become bloated, a playground for rules lawyers and munchkins. A grand unified system would be good for the game.

Personally, I'm a fan of Big Eyes Small Mouth. It's simple, versatile, fast, only uses the D6, and it all comes in one book.


I would welcome a grand unified system as well. When one has been created get back to me. 4E is not that grand unified system. 3.5 was just shy of what I consider the perfect version of D&D. Having a preference for one thing over another isn't being slavishly loyal to a gaming system.

I like strawberry ice cream more than coffee ice cream as well. Honestly I hate coffee ice cream. You can't be wrong with an opinion.
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Telaril
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Postby Telaril » 30 Jul 2008, 07:06

Heh, I never upgraded past 2nd edition! Effective levels for monster races? Bah. Give me my experience ratio and be done with it! The effective level change was designed as an attack on people like me who like to play monster races, making it near impossible to play one in a normal starter campaign! It depresses me that people see 3rd and 3.5 edition as D&D. Gygax didn't even work on them! How can it be D&D without the hand of Gygax? Fools! Heretics!
/irony

Kidding aside, I do seriously have a great deal of respect for Gygax, and never had any problem with 2nd edition.

My DM really didn't like 3rd edition when it rolled around, and so we never switched over. Luckily, 2nd edition books were real cheap at used bookstores.

The last D&D I played was... well... D&D. In the old blue and red boxes. My friends broke it out in honor of Gygax's death. (I have some friends who are... grown ups. But don't tell them I said that.) We played a few weeks of Keep on the Borderlands. It was rad. Many people died. I was an Elf!

I hang out on some boards that have a lot of older fans. They talked about how when they were kids, you'd give the red or blue D&D box to a ten year old, and he could break it open and play it with his friends. So bringing D&D back to being easy out of the box... isn't really a corruption at all. D&D started as a dead simple imagination game for kids.

By the way, I loved this video, I think it may have been the first video that made me listen to the podcast. And now I'm posting on the forums. Maybe D&D IS evil.

Oh, and here's an awesome wired article I found: What if Cooking Fans talked about Cookbooks like geeks talk about RPG books

Posted: 2:17 a.m. by LordOrcus I have read the new Better Joy Cookbook and I am devastated to my very core. Their macaroni and cheese recipe, the very macaroni and cheese I've been making since I was in college, has been ravaged and disfigured and left bleeding on the page. Where once it contained only cheddar cheese, now the recipe calls for a mix of cheddar and Colby. It may contain macaroni, and it may contain cheese, but it is not macaroni and cheese. This is a slap in the face and a knife in the gut. You have lost me, Better Joy Cookbook. I would bid you goodbye, but I wish you nothing but the pain and rage you have delivered unto me.
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Evil Jim
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"The Little Wish"

Postby Evil Jim » 30 Jul 2008, 20:57

I miss cantrips. :(
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Tetsubo
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Re: "The Little Wish"

Postby Tetsubo » 31 Jul 2008, 03:44

Evil Jim wrote:I miss cantrips. :(


So long as you play 3.5, you can have cantrips forever.
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Bryy M. Miller
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Postby Bryy M. Miller » 05 Aug 2008, 10:36

This has to be the single-most brilliant sketch you guys have ever done.
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Tetsubo
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Postby Tetsubo » 29 Aug 2008, 22:44

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Yukikaze
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Postby Yukikaze » 30 Aug 2008, 13:21

Hmm, now that I've actually had a chance to look at the 4E handbook, I see.

It's still a bloated playground for powergamers and munchkins. It's just all in one book, now.

They dropped my favorite alignments and pretend they never existed, Elves are now called Elothar, half-Elves are now called Elves, and Humans are divided between Half-Elves and Humans. Dragonborn are munchkin-bait, as are Tieflings as a defaultable player race. I have to look back at the 3.5E handbook and see if it took as pretentious a tone as the 4th edition PHB has, and somehow they've managed to make the game shallower AND more complicated to play at the same time.

I have neither time nor reason to learn the updated rules right now, and if I don't bother to learn the rules, I doubt I'll ever have the reason to justify the time investment needed in the future.
Cybren
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Postby Cybren » 30 Aug 2008, 13:48

Yukikaze wrote:I find it amusing that someone with a signature decrying uniformity would be so resistant to natural change and mutation of a gaming system. In my eyes, DnD 3.5 has become bloated, a playground for rules lawyers and munchkins. A grand unified system would be good for the game.

Personally, I'm a fan of Big Eyes Small Mouth. It's simple, versatile, fast, only uses the D6, and it all comes in one book.

i think the thing is, and they have been doing this for a while, most "new editions" of D&D are really different games with the same concept (kill monsters and take their stuff).
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Tetsubo
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Postby Tetsubo » 31 Aug 2008, 00:57

I've said it before, 4E isn't so much the latest edition of D&D as a first edition of a new tactical miniatures game that has a role-playing expansion package attached. They tacked on the D&D name to drum up business. Marketing, pure and simple. But you can't polish a turd, no matter how hard you try.
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