Doctor Who

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Merrymaker_Mortalis
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Merrymaker_Mortalis » 17 Oct 2015, 12:11

Felt like an episode that plants seeds. Monster needs to return.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Robo4900 » 17 Oct 2015, 18:06

I liked the episode. Definitely setting up stuff. Very glad that they finally addressed Peter Capaldi being in the show already.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby MotorWaffle » 18 Oct 2015, 14:49

I...really disliked this episode. If it's setting up stuff, which it looked like it was, then I have no problem thinking that stuff may be great. There were just a bunch of things about this episode that bothered me.
1. I know Doctor Who plays the rules of reality fast and loose, but the thing with the electric eels shot past the line between reality and Loony Tunes. The entire mechanical setup they had was less genius plan and more Wile E. Coyote.
2. The plan was to steal a helmet and project an image of what I'm guessing was supposed to be the World Serpent into the other helmets. Cool. So why did the guy without a helmet still run? Why did the leader not see the real puppet with his biologic eye? He closes the biologic eye to watch the video, so clearly he's only getting a feed through one eye.
3. Maisie's death. Maybe I'm wrong, but the impression I got was that the Doctor knew that her dying from the helmet was at least a possibility (he doesn't examine her, doesn't run over, just knows that she's dead), but there is NO hint that he has any reservations about it. Not only that, but no one calls him out it, or so much as raises an eyebrow. I just did not believe anyone's reaction to the situation was genuine, especially after the scenes in the last episode where people questioned Clara and Doctor about their willingness to risk and sacrifice people.
4. The chip that can give you immortality. This breaks everything. They can't be rare if a standard soldier's helmet has TWO of them equipped. If they never stop and can bring you back from the dead, why doesn't every soldier have one in them already? What about characters like Davros or the Master/Mistress who have had story arcs about prolonging their lives? They don't care about causing "ripples and tidal waves" so what's stopping them? And what about that speech the Doctor gave one episode ago about the sanctity of life and death?
5. I still don't like the sonic sunglasses. I'm sorry, but they're just not growing on me. Smaller complaint, I know, but still.
6. I buy babies communicating in their own way. I don't buy a baby trying to tell everyone to use the electric eels in ways no one of that time period had ever conceived of before.


It's a long list, I know, but I still really like Capaldi's Doctor, no one acted out the story badly, I just don't think the story made any sense, even by Doctor Who standards.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Robo4900 » 18 Oct 2015, 18:52

Well, TBH, I agree with you, but I still liked the episode. Kind of like Robot Of Sherwood; enjoyable, but flawed.

Although, the baby thing was probably just the baby's mind wondering. The guy said that the baby is calmed by being in the place with the eels, so maybe the baby was thinking about the eels to calm herself.
Also, the guy with the eye thing didn't have a biological eye I don't think... Wasn't that just part of the hologram?

Again, though, I did like the episode still, and I'm looking forward to the results of what it's set up
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Darkflame » 19 Oct 2015, 01:53

The whole face was a hologram. Those things dont look human with their helmets off - their leader was the space species.
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The baby thing I think was strongly hinted;

The babies "remembering in the wrong direction". It wasnt coming up with the plan, it was just sensing what the plan was going to be. Essentially it turns this episode also into a bootstrap paradox.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby tbug » 20 Oct 2015, 11:49

Kill the Moon was the point where I realized that I had to turn off the part of my brain that understands basic scientific principles and just watch. Eggs gaining mass from nothingness surely trumps electric eels being used as generators, or at least matches it.

I disagree with nothing you said, MotorWaffle; I'm just explaining why those points didn't ruin the episode for me.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Antitonic » 20 Oct 2015, 12:11

This episode reinforced my opinions that we're overdue for both a companion death (not just trapped in an alternate dimension), and a non-contemporary Earth companion. The former is less likely for a while given we maybe know how Clara's story ends(?), but come on. All of time and space, billions of worlds, limitless choices of curious travellers that by chance resemble humans? Nah, let's just grab a new 20th/21st century Londoner again, the pound's got a special on.

Related, but not condemning, I'm tired of Clara, well and truly. Not that she's a bad character, she's just wearing thin on me.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby tbug » 20 Oct 2015, 13:17

I would also like to see a return to the Doctor having more than one companion.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Merrymaker_Mortalis » 20 Oct 2015, 13:44

I like Clara. I just want them to tie her off.

I feel like her arc is going to be "my love of my life is dead, so now I have nothing to ground me. I like my job and family but I want THE DOCTOR because those are boring in comparison. -> This attitude comes and bites her hard.
She ends up being burnt. She either dies or she realizes how selfish she has actually been.

Yeah her relationship with her Dad has worn thin because of her step mother, but she realises that her grand mother is awesome."

I think I want Clara to take responsibility. I think her character is acting selfishly now. She seems to be living solely for herself. She doesn't register how much she means to the Doctor or her family (who are never shown), or even some of the pupils.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Darkflame » 20 Oct 2015, 13:50

tbug wrote:Kill the Moon was the point where I realized that I had to turn off the part of my brain that understands basic scientific principles and just watch. Eggs gaining mass from nothingness surely trumps electric eels being used as generators, or at least matches it.


It was the idea that not having a moon may cause problems for people on earth that got to me :lol:
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Merrymaker_Mortalis » 24 Oct 2015, 14:11

Nice to have a talky episode that's really interesting.
I fear the kiddies will have found it boring and uninteresting.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Darkflame » 01 Nov 2015, 13:00

Another good one (so far)

This has been a really strong season.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby tbug » 01 Nov 2015, 13:31

I'm surprised by how much I'm enjoying the lack of a strong season-long plot. I think that the return to multi-part stories is also a big help.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Robo4900 » 01 Nov 2015, 17:31

Agreed.

Great episode, glad the Zygons thing is being revisited. The parallels with current events were interesting, too.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby tbug » 01 Nov 2015, 20:26

The hint about the hybrid was just enough plot thread. It was like when you'd see "Bad Wolf" in the background in 2005.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby MotorWaffle » 02 Nov 2015, 17:08

Firstly, I liked the discussions Maisie's character and the Doctor had about needing human perspectives and the implications of being a walking time abyss. I still think the standard issue tablets that bring you back from the dead/make you immortal were way to cheap a plot device for what they were capable of, but they did things with the implications of its effects that I liked.

As for the Zygons, I thought it was a pretty great episode. If I had to critique on thing it would be that characters sometimes seemed to get the idiot ball (I'm loving tvtropes terms right now for some reason) for the sake of moving the plot forward.

And if I had to make one prediction it'd be that Kate Lethbridge-Stewart absolutely got the better of her Zygon assassin and is infiltrating their organization.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Merrymaker_Mortalis » 06 Nov 2015, 13:07

I felt the episode started a bit z z z z, but it certainly got interesting from then on.
They certainly turned the Zygons from weird-funny body-horror into dark and twisted.

Fake Clara encouraging the soldiers to slaughter the podded humans was really dark
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Arclight_Dynamo » 11 Nov 2015, 18:14

Well, I just caught up on the most recent series/season. I'd been leaving it off since just before last year's Christmas Special since the past couple of series/seasons didn't quite resonate with me.

I have to say, I've been very pleasantly surprised. This is a solid run of episodes. A lot of what had been bothering me has been done away with. I'm even digging the double-episodes format.

Hell of a turnaround; I'm looking forward to seeing where this goes.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Robo4900 » 14 Nov 2015, 14:35

... What the hell was that?
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Merrymaker_Mortalis » 15 Nov 2015, 09:57

Robo4900 wrote:... What the hell was that?


Yeah. I agree.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Darkflame » 15 Nov 2015, 10:31

First dud for me that one. I kinda liked the end twist (as it was different to w hat I expected).
But still "meh" overall.

I mean, honestly, if I want to see a bunch of people going without sleep and surrounded by sand I have better options right now.

Query;
Right at the start we were seeing from the eyes of some robot or AI no? Yet that was dropped half way without explanation?
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Robo4900 » 16 Nov 2015, 20:28

First dud of the season for me, too. And also, I don't think the robot thing was the only thing to be dropped half-way through for no reason.

My problem with the sleep thing is the monster doesn't make sense. It's a monster that's the sleep from your eyes, both metaphorically and literally? And it's also dust? But it's blind? But not really? And it can shape-shift? Also, I'm not a fan of the found footage style. If it was a really good episode, I wouldn't mind it, but TBH I find it distracting, and more of a hindrance than anything else(Especially the camera changes, which are really jarring).

And the twist at the end? I HATED that. It meant that an already bad episode wasn't even canon(And therefore, watching it was pointless), and the weird meta nature of it just doesn't feel right to me. Also, what happened about Clara and the whole eye sleep thing? Or did I misinterpret that? (Which is quite easy given that the episode made no sense)
Honestly, this is the worst case of the "It was all a dream" trope I've ever seen, and IMO the worst episode of Doctor Who I've ever seen(Overtaking 1966's The Gunfighters).
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Merrymaker_Mortalis » 17 Nov 2015, 02:17

I swore at the episode in my mind at the end, repeatedly.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Elomin Sha » 17 Nov 2015, 02:40

Huh, Missy is in Gotham.
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Re: Doctor Who

Postby Darkflame » 17 Nov 2015, 05:30

Robo4900 wrote:First dud of the season for me, too. And also, I don't think the robot thing was the only thing to be dropped half-way through for no reason.

My problem with the sleep thing is the monster doesn't make sense. It's a monster that's the sleep from your eyes, both metaphorically and literally? And it's also dust? But it's blind? But not really? And it can shape-shift? Also, I'm not a fan of the found footage style. If it was a really good episode, I wouldn't mind it, but TBH I find it distracting, and more of a hindrance than anything else(Especially the camera changes, which are really jarring).

And the twist at the end? I HATED that. It meant that an already bad episode wasn't even canon(And therefore, watching it was pointless), and the weird meta nature of it just doesn't feel right to me. Also, what happened about Clara and the whole eye sleep thing? Or did I misinterpret that? (Which is quite easy given that the episode made no sense)
Honestly, this is the worst case of the "It was all a dream" trope I've ever seen, and IMO the worst episode of Doctor Who I've ever seen(Overtaking 1966's The Gunfighters).


Im not sure, when I saw it I didn't think the intention was
it was all a dream. Merely that he arranged the whole scenario specifically to film it. It still happened, but it was all deliberate.

The episode was confusing though so I might be wrong.
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