The Sex Thread 2: Because Two Hands Are Better Than One

[Bebop Man]

Do we really "fear" whores?

[viscomica]

Hmm, I wouldn't say they are "feared" just looked upon with content / disapproval by society.

[Amake]

Maybe a little more than just the average fear of everyone who's different. One might perceive a woman sex worker as a woman whose sexuality is not directly under control of a man, threatening the whole paternal legacy paradigm by having children with who knows what fathers. But yeah, mostly disapproval and hate for their perceived low moral character.

[Bebop Man]

One might perceive a woman sex worker as a woman whose sexuality is not directly under control of a man,

What about their pimps?

[My pseudonym is Ix]

From a purely personal standpoint, I disapprove of prostitution as a trade simply because it's not something I find particularly tasteful and because it attracts abuse and illegality like flies to a pot of jam. I certainly wouldn't say I fear prostitutes as such, particularly since they have practically zero impact on my life, but if I were in such a place as to be approached by one then I reckon I'm not in a great part of town, so I'd probably be on edge.

[Drecon]

One might perceive a woman sex worker as a woman whose sexuality is not directly under control of a man,

What about their pimps?

I'm not sure how it is in other countries, but over here the 'pimps' are usually aged prostitutes that have started their own business...

Well... except for the ones that lure innocent women from eastern Europe and/or Asia, promising them a 'modeling career'.... For those kinds of people I wouldn't mind bringing back the death sentence.

[Duckay]

I very strongly approve of the legalization and regulation of prostitution as an industry, so this makes me happy.

[Amake]

Yeah, pimps may or may not give that impression of control. It's complicated, especially as those pimps who do tend to overlap with pimps who inspire murder thoughts as Drecon touches on. 'S why I said "might".

As for me, funny story. I was once offered three hundred dollars to have sex with a man and turned him down, while standing in his shower with his hand on my ass. Later that week a woman begged me to give her three dollars for sex, and I gave her three dollars to leave me alone (and a spiel about having just gotten out of a serious relationship so she wouldn't think that I didn't want to sleep with her because she was black) (when in fact I was just scared of intimacy). Which left me with just over three dollars in the bank. It was an interesting month.

[Avistew]

I think prostitutes can be feared. I've definitely known women who saw them as a threat. But I think mostly they're treated condescendingly, with a "poor woman who isn't actually doing this because she decided to" kind of attitude which is annoying, as prostitution being legal basically mean you retain control of your own body, including the right to loan it to someone else for a specific purpose (sex).

I know there is a stereotype of a male pimp who is exploiting his "girls" but I too am more familiar with older women, who sometime still offer their services, but mostly are in charge of organizing things for other women, as well as taking measures towards their safety and so on. Male "pimps" I've heard of were usually more along the lines of bodyguards than exploiters.

I absolutely approve of the laws being struck down. They made little sense, as if you're against prostitution, it didn't prevent it, just made it less safe, and I can't imagine why you would want that.

About brothers, I have to say, I'm not sure... I would need to like both of them of course, and for both of them to like me, but I think it might be awkward for them. I'm also not sure if you mean sex with both of them at once, or sex with both, but not at the same time. I usually find threesomes to be overrated, I'd rather have one-on-one time with partners.

As for it being incest... meh. Might be because I'm French but to me the concept of brothers seeing each other naked is, well, normal. I'm not sure it's such a problem to see each other having sex, either, although if it grossed them out, obviously it would be their call. I wouldn't consider that incest at all at any rate, unless they went out of their way to, say, but their mouth where the other's genital had just been, soon enough that they can taste it.

Sorry if that was too graphic, some people might get triggered by these things.

Anyways, in short, not my fantasy but I don't really have anything against it either so I'm not ruling it out if stars happened to be aligned.

[Amake]

I can't imagine why you would want that.

Well, if you are "against prostitution", and I'm of course talking about the generic "you" here, I imagine you have to not understand that you can't have laws that stop sex work from happening. It's like trying to fix poverty by outlawing poor people; thinking you just have to punish people enough for doing what you think they're doing wrong to keep everyone from doing it, while failing to imagine there may be reasons for them doing it which are beyond their power to change, because from your position of privilege you do not comprehend the idea of having no power. If I may speculate.

[viscomica]

I don't support prostitution in any way and personally, I wouldn't think too highly of a prostitute. But as a law student, and more importantly, as a human being, I think it's important they are safe and that they're assured they have rights, basic human rights every human being should have. And I think the Supreme Court completely understood those laws were not securing the prostitutes the exercise of their rights.

[JustAName]

Why wouldn't you? My roommate has stated that in the Firefly universe, she'd probably be a companion, and I think I might as well.

[viscomica]

Hmm, I dislike the idea of selling sex, as if sex is just a product that the masses can consume. I don't like the idea even though I can understand there are people who are ok with it. It's a completely personal take on the subject that I do not intend to change.

[Laurnil]

You know what? As a busy women, I would love it if I could go pay a guy 50 bucks to get laid. No fuss, no muss, just sex and go get groceries. Hell, I would have loved to have that as a way to get extra cash in college. I don't think anyone should be looked down upon for being a sex worker, whether you agree with it or not.

[Amake]

This is perhaps a sidetrack, but I'm curious, viscomica. What makes you so sure that you don't want to change your mind? Like, suppose you found out you were wrong, your opinion built on false and incomplete information and impossible to support, would you then refuse to acknowledge that fact or betray your principle of not changing your opinion? Neither alternative seems very appealing.

Also yeah, sex is a pretty big deal to me, hypothetically it would be a very special thing, I have this romantic fantasy that the first woman I sleep with will also be the last, but still, it wouldn't hurt to have the option, to have it be possible to just go and buy some sex, without complication, without suffering, without stigma, without society thinking less of a person for doing that business with me.

[Duckay]

My first question to anyone who says that they look down on prostitutes is usually "do you also look down on people who go to prostitutes?" I understand the reasoning that some people don't believe that sex should be a commodity, but only if that judgement applies across the board.

But as I said, we all know I'm very much in favour of legal, regulated prostitution. This came up at work once and my coworker said he was surprised that I was so utterly unfazed by the idea, as apparently some others had been outraged/uncomfortable about it.

[viscomica]

You know what? As a busy women, I would love it if I could go pay a guy 50 bucks to get laid. No fuss, no muss, just sex and go get groceries. Hell, I would have loved to have that as a way to get extra cash in college. I don't think anyone should be looked down upon for being a sex worker, whether you agree with it or not.

Well, that is your opinion.

[Bebop Man]

Maybe in the first world women can be whores for laughs and because lol money yay, but on this side of the world they're a depressing bunch made up by underaged immigrants smuggled across borders while hooked on drugs. I vote lawfulness and regulation but I'm always going to feel sorry for them. Also bear in mind South America is deeply Catholic (parts anyway) and women tend to be more prudish about whoring. Probably why they need to kidnap 'em to run the business in the first place.

[viscomica]

This is perhaps a sidetrack, but I'm curious, viscomica. What makes you so sure that you don't want to change your mind? Like, suppose you found out you were wrong, your opinion built on false and incomplete information and impossible to support, would you then refuse to acknowledge that fact or betray your principle of not changing your opinion? Neither alternative seems very appealing.

I think it's not a matter of empirical proof of me being wrong, it's just a matter of opinions. I believe it's wrong to offer sex to random strangers for money, why? Because I don't like it. Because it makes me unconfortable to think that for some people sex isn't something intimate but their job. Of course, those are entirely personal opinions based on my own subjetivity. I'm not saying that makes them bad people, because that would be stupid, just saying I (personally speaking) don't like it and could live without it.

[viscomica]

My first question to anyone who says that they look down on prostitutes is usually "do you also look down on people who go to prostitutes?" I understand the reasoning that some people don't believe that sex should be a commodity, but only if that judgement applies across the board.

Yes, yes I do. I have to be coherent with what I think, at the very least.

[CryssCross]

As someone who works with gogo dancers in gay clubs, and has worked backstage for Chippendales, I see no reason to fear prostitution. Physical pleasure is every bit a service. If you look at it as buying sex, you are paying for an action. Such as paying to see a concert. You get pleasure from being part of experience. You are not buying the person, so there is no solid footing in a lawfully wrong case here. However the morality set forth by society is what drives someone's negative opinion towards it.

And when considering the dangers of prostitution (such as STIs and robbery) may I ask what chances do you take when going to (to use my earlier reference) concerts or other events where you are surrounded by strangers? Risks are risks, and life is life.

[Avistew]

I totally get the idea of people not being into casual sex, and sex for money is pretty much always casual (there are some cases of long-term friends paying each other for sex but usually it's pretty much a stranger), but I'm not sure why it would make such a difference whether money is involved or not.

What I mean is, if you issue with prostitution is that you think sex should be more special, then surely casual sex in general is as distasteful to you, right?

Now, there is a difference between people who think/say "Well I don't like it. Not for me as a customer or worker" and people who think/say "I don't like it, so nobody should be allowed to do it."

I wouldn't have a huge problem doing it myself, in the right circumstances (which mostly involved it not being looked down upon so much), although I don't think I'd hire someone because it wouldn't do anything for me.

[Lord Hosk]

I paid my wife over $2500 to have sex with me... Im about to buy her a house so she will keep doing it... Prostitution would be cheaper

[Laurnil]

Maybe in the first world women can be whores for laughs and because lol money yay, but on this side of the world they're a depressing bunch made up by underaged immigrants smuggled across borders while hooked on drugs. I vote lawfulness and regulation but I'm always going to feel sorry for them. Also bear in mind South America is deeply Catholic (parts anyway) and women tend to be more prudish about whoring. Probably why they need to kidnap 'em to run the business in the first place.

Dude, I used to walk to college in a neighborhood filled with crack whores. It's depressing here, too. But, my stance is you really shouldn't look down on anybody, because given a certain set of circumstance and life choices, that might be you.

[viscomica]

Now, there is a difference between people who think/say "Well I don't like it. Not for me as a customer or worker" and people who think/say "I don't like it, so nobody should be allowed to do it."

I don't think that since I don't like it nobody should do it. Actually, I think it should be legal in most parts of the world (given the current situation in my country regarding trafficking and the government's futile attempts to do anything about it, I wouldn't recommend it here) but that doesn't make me feel less uneasy about the fact that some people do it.