Ferguson

[AdmiralMemo]

Really? I'd be interested in seeing articles on this.

[korvys]

I'm against the riots.

Me too. I'm not sure why you'd assume otherwise. But I just don't think you can separate the two things.

I don't want there to be riots.
I don't want there to be the anger that drives the people to riot.
I don't want there to be injustice that angers the people.
I don't want there to be the racism that leads to injustice.

[JustAName]

http://www.inquisitr.com/1671917/berkely-oakland-protests-protesters-say-undercover-officers-tried-to-incite-looting/
http://www.occupy.com/article/unmasking-black-bloc-who-they-are-what-they-do-how-they-work

[Rikadyn]

http://www.crimethinc.com/blog/2014/12/ ... k-windows/

[korvys]

Rikadyn, that, and the comments below it, was incredibly fascinating.

It's so easy to write off vandalism as mindless. Even after reading that, there's a part of me saying "yeah, but *this* mob really is mindless". I'm not sure if that's some lingering racism, or just, being fairly well off, not being able to picture myself in their situation as easily. It's hard to be detached. I can only imagine how hard it would be like for someone closer to the situation.

[AdmiralMemo]

The mayor has declared that she thinks there should be safe, designated places for people to riot and destroy stuff... The governor has declared martial law and has called in the National Guard... Things are crazy here right now...

The thing that gets me is that there are fires raging, and firefighters who are trying to put them out... and some of them are getting attacked by the rioters! That is ridiculous! Fire doesn't care one bit who you are! It'll burn you and your stuff no matter what. Fighting the police, even police that were not involved in the situation, makes some sort of sense, whether you agree with it or not. They're the face of an establishment that may have wronged you. Fine. That's a separate discussion. But firefighters? What have firefighters ever done that would cause you to fight them? They're trying to put the fires out so they don't spread and hurt people. Who could possibly be against that?

[korvys]

Hmmm. I can find a report of rioters cutting a firehose, and a fire truck pulling up and then leaving, but nothing about firefighters being attacked. Link?

[AdmiralMemo]

I unfortunately cannot link to a PM conversation between me and a friend of mine who is in the fire department.

[Tycherin]

If you ask me, it isn't about firefighters, it's about not being heard.

Think of it like this. Imagine you're at a hotel, and you're ready to check in. You ring the little bell on the desk to try to get someone's attention. You can see people in the office, but none of them pay any attention. You ring again, a little more loudly, then wait for a while. Maybe they're busy. I'm sure someone will be out here soon. You ring it again, twice this time - c'mon, what's taking so long? You try shooting glances in the window, but the hotel employees keep ignoring you. Eventually you get fed up and start hammering on the bell, just trying to get someone's attention. Finally, one of the janitorial staff comes over and moves the bell under the counter. And you, in your righteous indignation, snap at her - not because she did something wrong per se, but because you are <i>really goddamned tired</i> of having no one listen to you.

It's like that, except a million times more serious. Does it justify attacking firefighters? Hell no, but there is still a reason behind it.

[korvys]

Hmmm. Given the current stories, I'd expect the media to jump on that. Which presumably means no-one has told them that. I wonder why not?

[Rikadyn]

Media will sell any form of public protest which ever way best highlights the status quo or can be used for their own political gain. Thus we have fox news trying to sell the protestors as thugs to fulfill their racist propaganda and everyone else saying that it is just a few ruining a peaceful protest and if we just waited for the status quo to punish itself everything will be fine.

[JustAName]

http://www.salon.com/2015/04/30/baltimore_public_defender_speaks_out_against_brutal_holding_cell_conditions_using_bread_as_pillows/

[AdmiralMemo]

Yeah, Central Booking has been terrible for many years. It's sad and angering.

Also, completely unrelated, but that post has the picture of the one policeman who bugged me by having his riot shield upside-down.