Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Drop by and talk about anything you want. This is where all cheese-related discussions should go
User avatar
Elomin Sha
Posts: 15774
Joined: 22 Feb 2008, 05:14
First Video: Max Effect
Location: Woodford Green, England
Contact:

Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Elomin Sha » 29 Apr 2016, 12:19

Saw the film before work ,and I really enjoyed it. It was better than Winter Soldier in some aspects, but WS did have a little more intrigue. There are two button scenes but I only stayed for the first. Really needed the restroom. WIll be going back to watch it again soon.

Comic relief was really good between Ant-Man and Spider-Man with the latter carrying the load and doing a great job too. Using Ant-Man as a comical but deadly weapon was nice.
You can see the hints of a relationship between Scarlet Witch and Vision as per the comics but it's not beating you over the head with it.
The only down side was discovering an aspect to Stark's/Bucky's past. It isn't very shocking as you can guess the relation early on.
I am looking forward to the Black Panther film too. He was in the film just enough to whet appetites.
The most unique, nicest, and confusing individual you will get to know. Don't be stupid around me, that's my job.
https://displate.com/elominsha/galleries
If you need art, I take commissions, PM me.
Darkflame
Posts: 402
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 05:06
First Video: Quantum Documentary

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Darkflame » 30 Apr 2016, 15:28

Yeah, I really enjoyed it. Just got back.
I felt the peaks wernt as strong as Winter Soldier, but also it held up better in its last 1/3rd where the second film didn't quite keep it up.
Both fantastic films though, and this film did a especially good job of juggling so many characters.
No real spoilers for me to talk about yet....still sort of digesting it all.
oh, except;
I thought Black Panther was excellent. Much more screen-time then I expected - and really had one of the more important arcs at the end there. He gave up his hatred while Stark and Cap were still fighting. Brief scene but felt important - it made it his story in that moment.
http://www.fanficmaker.com <-- Tells some truly terrible tales.
--
Last update; Mice,Plumbers,Animatronics and Airbenders. We also have the socials; Facebook & G+. Give us a like if you can, it all helps.
User avatar
Bebop Man
Posts: 4465
Joined: 22 May 2013, 22:55
First Video: The Pirate Video
Location: The Black Lodge

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Bebop Man » 04 May 2016, 18:48

I thought it was The Marvel Movie all over. Fun overall, great action, cool side characters (Falcon steals the show), boring villain, fake "stakes", everything goes back to normal by the end.
Image
Darkflame
Posts: 402
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 05:06
First Video: Quantum Documentary

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Darkflame » 05 May 2016, 04:22

But everything did not go back to normal :?
Also a bit confused what you mean by fake stakes. It wasn't about saving the world this time....but that makes it more different to the others, not the same.
http://www.fanficmaker.com <-- Tells some truly terrible tales.
--
Last update; Mice,Plumbers,Animatronics and Airbenders. We also have the socials; Facebook & G+. Give us a like if you can, it all helps.
DrAppleman
Posts: 8
Joined: 27 Aug 2015, 06:52
First Video: Probably omni lingual but I'm not sure
Location: Reykjavík, Iceland

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby DrAppleman » 05 May 2016, 06:41

Bebop Man wrote:I thought it was The Marvel Movie all over. Fun overall, great action, cool side characters (Falcon steals the show), boring villain, fake "stakes", everything goes back to normal by the end.


I don't think we saw the same movie, just because the universe wasn't ending didn't make the stakes less real also in what universe is it going back to normal?
Kapol
Posts: 6120
Joined: 25 Nov 2010, 03:31
First Video: Whisky Tango Foxtrot
Location: The ever-shifting landscape of the mind

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Kapol » 05 May 2016, 19:22

I felt it was meh. The major characters felt entirely outshined by the side characters. Spider Man, Ant Man, and Black Panther stole the show. Every other one felt like they were going through the same old song and dance. Which seems weird considering the basis in internal conflict.

I think the thing that bothers me most is that it doesn't feel like it should have been a Captain America movie. While the advertising made it seem like there's a good basis for an argument between the two sides, having it happen from Cap's point of view with the knowledge he's the primary character kind of cheapened that for me. Like the fact we know as viewers that Bucky likely was innocent, and that one person was pulling most of the strings. If they did want it to be Captain America's movie, I feel like they shouldn't have put so much focus on the secondary characters. As much as I enjoyed them, they all felt like they were just there to be established and do stuff rather than add to the narrative.

There were also threads that never felt finished. Who hired the goons at the beginning? If it was the main antagonist, why? Why did he want a pathogen? Did he somehow know it'd help add fuel to the fire of the whole Avengers thing? Speaking of, why did Scarlet Witch get so much hate? Had the not done what she had, a lot more people would have died, considering the size of the explosion.

As for the ending, it tried to make it seem like stuff wasn't going back to normal. But it feels like it's the same as Winter Soldier's ending. Something major has happened. But the characters end up in this weird holding pattern. The events of the movie will be referenced, but likely not play a major role later. There's some excuse that allows them to move around the world freely, with the supplies they need. And despite being unarmed, Bucky and Cap managed to free the imprisoned Avengers somehow. To top it off, Cap is always just a phone call away when the Infinity Gems start to matter again.

Seeing the movie made me look forward to every single coming movie that Marvel is doing. Even the Doctor Strange ad looked awesome. But this one just felt like it was something to do while waiting for other movies to happen.
User avatar
betsytheripper
Posts: 251
Joined: 12 Nov 2013, 21:49
First Video: Scientist's Rebuttal to ICP
Location: Fields and Cows and Fields

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby betsytheripper » 05 May 2016, 22:10

I just got back from seeing it, and definitely still digesting but... I don't think I liked it.

I thought the action scenes were good, and I really liked the Steve/Bucky storyline. I personally don't like Tony Stark as a character and this movie just kind of... Cemented that feeling for me. But...

I hate that they brought in Spiderman. He was annoying. I really dislike that the entire fight scene was a comedy sequence. A little wry humor here or there is enjoyable but it was just too much. And I feel like that kiss with Sharon was shoehorned in so obviously, I thought my eyes were going to fall out I rolled them so hard.

I think I'll probably see it again soon, on a quiet Wednesday morning (the talkativeness of the crowd certainly didn't help my mood), but right now... Meh. So very meh. Maybe it could have done better with a little more gravitas? I feel like the tone of the film was forced to be something it really wasn't.
-betsy
Darkflame
Posts: 402
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 05:06
First Video: Quantum Documentary

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Darkflame » 07 May 2016, 06:47

I am still utterly baffled how anyone can think this movie ends how it starts. :P
Pretty much every character is in a fundamentally different position at the end. Either emotionally, physically or legally. Did people expect a lot of deaths or something :? Because I cant see what would be a example of things changing if not what the film had.

It was, however, Avengers 2.5. No question there.

But I dont see that as a bad thing. Id also point out the previous movie focused way more on other characters then Cap (relatively to the first) and it was all the better for it.

" While the advertising made it seem like there's a good basis for an argument between the two sides, having it happen from Cap's point of view with the knowledge he's the primary character kind of cheapened that for me"

I think your looking at that the wrong way.
Just because he is the title character does not make his side "right" and the other side "wrong" - the movie didnt paint anything that clear cut.
Yes, he was correct about Bucky. But Bucky wasn't the real conflict. Cap had already made up his mind before that point.
The central conflict was about accountability vs independence. Bucky was the emotional example for that conflict (from caps viewpoint), but it wasn't the conflict itself.

In fact, as far as I am concerned, Cap was wrong, although in a understandable way. The avengers should be accountable to the world at large, and not just eachother. They won good will by saving the world, but they are still a crazy powerfull private military organisation - who can and do make mistakes. Forget Wanda - think Ultron.
Now, Cap has every right to be skeptical given the previous "authority" was previously Hydra in disguise. But that doesn't mean IronMan & Co are wrong to be worried that they are, effectively, unchecked.

Its a good conflict.
http://www.fanficmaker.com <-- Tells some truly terrible tales.
--
Last update; Mice,Plumbers,Animatronics and Airbenders. We also have the socials; Facebook & G+. Give us a like if you can, it all helps.
Kapol
Posts: 6120
Joined: 25 Nov 2010, 03:31
First Video: Whisky Tango Foxtrot
Location: The ever-shifting landscape of the mind

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Kapol » 07 May 2016, 15:31

Darkflame wrote:I am still utterly baffled how anyone can think this movie ends how it starts. :P
Pretty much every character is in a fundamentally different position at the end. Either emotionally, physically or legally. Did people expect a lot of deaths or something :? Because I cant see what would be a example of things changing if not what the film had.


I disagree with you there. How are they really in any different positions other than in a literal sense?

Sure, they aren't literally together, and there's friction between them. But it's clear that they don't really hate one another. The only person that any of them seem to hate from the other side is that Tony hates Bucky. And even that doesn't matter with Bucky going on ice. If they actually wanted to have consequences, leave the captured avengers in the super jail. Make it seem like there's more conflict between the two sides. Hell, just make it seem like life is going to be harder for the non-vengers. The fact that they cut to Cap in another super-technology facility after the credits was a huge turn off for me. He still has access to most of the stuff that he did before. At least that's how it seems to me. So them being technically criminals doesn't seem like it's going to be a major hindrance to them. The only trouble that'll cause is the weirdness when Avengers 3 comes out. And by that point they'll have to deal with a massive threat that'll likely make all that stuff just vanish anyways.

It was, however, Avengers 2.5. No question there.

But I dont see that as a bad thing. Id also point out the previous movie focused way more on other characters then Cap (relatively to the first) and it was all the better for it.


I don't think Civil War being Avengers 2.5 is a bad thing. The fact they tried to tie the plot to Bucky as the major source of active conflict made it feel like two separate movies. One was the continued story of the Captain America movies. Which, as of now, have been largely standalone. The other was the Civil War aspect with the conflict between the two sides. And personally, I think the movie suffered for it.

I think your looking at that the wrong way.
Just because he is the title character does not make his side "right" and the other side "wrong" - the movie didnt paint anything that clear cut.
Yes, he was correct about Bucky. But Bucky wasn't the real conflict. Cap had already made up his mind before that point.
The central conflict was about accountability vs independence. Bucky was the emotional example for that conflict (from caps viewpoint), but it wasn't the conflict itself.

In fact, as far as I am concerned, Cap was wrong, although in a understandable way. The avengers should be accountable to the world at large, and not just eachother. They won good will by saving the world, but they are still a crazy powerfull private military organisation - who can and do make mistakes. Forget Wanda - think Ultron.
Now, Cap has every right to be skeptical given the previous "authority" was previously Hydra in disguise. But that doesn't mean IronMan & Co are wrong to be worried that they are, effectively, unchecked.

Its a good conflict.


The trouble is that the arguments for it happening, at least brought up in the movie, all seemed silly to me. The bomb at the beginning would have killed a lot more people, given the crowd around them. But they acted like people dying at all was because of Scarlet Witch. It's the same problem I have with the main antagonist's motivations. He's angry his family was killed during Avengers 2. But they would have died if Ultron had dropped it as he'd planned, too.

If it's because Tony created Ultron, I don't remember that being brought up at all. As far as I'm aware, that wasn't public knowledge. I think it should have been pushed a lot harder if it was. Even if it wasn't public knowledge, doing that between the characters and having it be a major argument would have worked better. And maybe it was. But I don't remember it being mentioned at all.

As for the center point of the conflict, I disagree with you there. The Accords were what caused the first strain. And there was arguments. But if Bucky hadn't been framed for the attack, or hadn't been in the picture at all, it wouldn't have exploded as much as it did. The villain's entire plan was to create conflict around Bucky. From how to deal with him to his past.

And, because of that, it feels to me like Cap was framed as being right. Even in the arguments around could go against him, it seemed to me that the movie was saying he was the correct one. Maybe it's because I feel the arguments made in the movie were poor. Or maybe it's because it felt like a lot of the promotion for it was focused on the monetary aspect of the issue. But it just didn't settle right with me.


I'll also admit that it seemed incredibly strange to me that Captain knew Bucky killed the Starks while Tony didn't. Even moreso that he kept it secret.
User avatar
Bebop Man
Posts: 4465
Joined: 22 May 2013, 22:55
First Video: The Pirate Video
Location: The Black Lodge

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Bebop Man » 08 May 2016, 17:55

Darkflame wrote:But everything did not go back to normal :?
Also a bit confused what you mean by fake stakes. It wasn't about saving the world this time....but that makes it more different to the others, not the same.

DrAppleman wrote:I don't think we saw the same movie, just because the universe wasn't ending didn't make the stakes less real also in what universe is it going back to normal?


Cap writes Tony a letter tantamount to "I mean come on, man" and continues to police the world unchecked while Tony sort of just smirks and lets him do it. All the registration hullaballoo is dropped, and everybody is back to square one. Nothing of consequence happens that hasn't been reversed by the end. Everybody's alive, everybody's okay, everybody keeps doing their thing. Unlike all the promotional material (and the first 2 hours of the movie) would have you believe, nothing of importance is compromised.
Image
User avatar
Master Gunner
Defending us from The Dutch!
Posts: 19383
Joined: 29 Oct 2006, 12:19
First Video: How To Talk Like A Pirate
Location: In Limbo.

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Master Gunner » 08 May 2016, 18:41

Pretty much a rehash of what other people have said, but my thoughts:

Blank Panther was awesome. Spidey was well done, but within the movie his only purpose was to balance the teams with Ant-Man joining Cap's side. Also, Aunt May gets younger in every incarnation. All the returning cast played their parts well, and go Stucky. Overall, I very much enjoyed it.

Unfortunately, I am on the side that takes issue with both the central conflict of the film, and the ending.

On the central conflict: It seemed to focus more on Tony and Stark not communicating well and going "well, I guess we have to fight now", rather than the exploring philosophical differences in their viewpoints. The whole conflict seemed rather one-sided with Cap being both "factually" and "morally" right (at least, that's the side the movie is pushing, with each side represented by Boy Scout Rogers (who also serves as the main view point) and the brash and arrogant Stark).

What the conflict boils down to: Cap wants to save his friend, and take out the guy framing him. Tony wants to stop Rogers...because of poor communication and a treaty Tony just signed to assuage his conscience (and it's not like Tony has had trouble helping mind-controlled people before, Hawkeye in Avengers 1 anyone?). Then the whole thing turns out to have being set up by some guy we've never heard of before.

The inciting villain being just "some boring" guy makes sense when the focus of the film is on the "Civil War". But we come back to the Civil War not being that exciting as a narrative conflict, as there's little actual exploration of their different philosophies in favour of jumping directly to "AND NOW WE FIGHT!". Also, I think Crossbones would have being better as the main villain, as he at least has an established presence in the franchise and motivation to want to take out Cap and the Avengers beyond a misplaced sense of vengeance.


On the ending: My problem here is that it was set up too cleanly to get all the Avengers back together. Other than some residual animosity between Tony and Stucky, everybody's basically still friends. The non-vengers have to keep a low profile, but are free and can keep working as a non-sanctioned team. Of the characters in this movie, only Spidey and Blank Panther have upcoming films before Infinity War, so we're unlikely to even explore the current situation before they all get back together again. You would expect a massive team-up movie called "CIVIL WAR" to mark a significant shift in the franchise, but right now it doesn't look like it will have any significant long-lasting effects or major plot threads to be picked up by other movies to run with.
TheRocket wrote:Apparently the crotch area could not contain the badonkadonk area.
Twitter | Click here to join the Desert Bus Community Chat.
User avatar
Elomin Sha
Posts: 15774
Joined: 22 Feb 2008, 05:14
First Video: Max Effect
Location: Woodford Green, England
Contact:

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Elomin Sha » 09 May 2016, 01:51

At you using Stucky as a ship name for Steve Rogers and Bucky? Ewwwww.
The most unique, nicest, and confusing individual you will get to know. Don't be stupid around me, that's my job.
https://displate.com/elominsha/galleries
If you need art, I take commissions, PM me.
User avatar
Master Gunner
Defending us from The Dutch!
Posts: 19383
Joined: 29 Oct 2006, 12:19
First Video: How To Talk Like A Pirate
Location: In Limbo.

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Master Gunner » 09 May 2016, 04:47

I didn't come up with it, I just roll with it.
TheRocket wrote:Apparently the crotch area could not contain the badonkadonk area.
Twitter | Click here to join the Desert Bus Community Chat.
User avatar
Elomin Sha
Posts: 15774
Joined: 22 Feb 2008, 05:14
First Video: Max Effect
Location: Woodford Green, England
Contact:

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Elomin Sha » 09 May 2016, 05:29

You're dead to me.
The most unique, nicest, and confusing individual you will get to know. Don't be stupid around me, that's my job.
https://displate.com/elominsha/galleries
If you need art, I take commissions, PM me.
User avatar
betsytheripper
Posts: 251
Joined: 12 Nov 2013, 21:49
First Video: Scientist's Rebuttal to ICP
Location: Fields and Cows and Fields

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby betsytheripper » 09 May 2016, 08:00

Stucky is love, Stucky is life.

Having had a little more time to consider, I agree with pretty much everything about there being no consequences. My biggest peeve, though, is still the tonal inconsistency. Particularly, the light heartedness of the fight scene ending in an event with actual consquences, but I feel we weren't emotionally geared towards the severity of that event and it felt like whiplash.

Everything else aside, I think that bugged me the most.

Also goooo Stucky.
-betsy
User avatar
Matt
LRR Crew
Posts: 9742
Joined: 14 Mar 2004, 00:19
Location: Victoria, BC
Contact:

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Matt » 15 May 2016, 10:06

I more or less disagree with the lot of you complaining about lack of consequences or stakes.

I had resigned myself to not commenting, but then moviebob posted the following article, and it articulates the why of my disagreement better than I could.

http://screenrant.com/why-civil-war-ending-works/

Tl;Dr: this movie had ENORMOUS emotional stakes, and virtually everyone in the film ends up in a fundamentally different operational place at the end than they were at the beginning.

-m
Image

I am not angry at you.
User avatar
Avistew
Posts: 2593
Joined: 12 Sep 2011, 18:34
First Video: Can't remember
Location: Oregon, USA

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Avistew » 15 May 2016, 13:08

I thought the villain's plan was really convoluted. Why is he going after the soldiers? We didn't even know they existed, and they're introduced only to be killed while in cryo? What was the point of that? And how did he know Iron Man would show up, that Cap wouldn't have told him about his parents, and that he would react that way?
Are we supposed to expect that he foresaw the whole sequence of events of Ask for breakfast > the body is found > while the scene is processed, the Bucky mask is found > Stark is told about it > Stark finds a way to figure out where Cap is headed, but also, Stark tells nobody else and goes alone (dick move, Tony, you could have at least tried to let Black Panther know who killed his dad)?
Am I the only one who found that super far fetched? What was his plan B? Wait in that bunker and maybe nobody ever shows up? And why the hell did he kill that many people for his revenge? So many of them were innocent, he's just acting like what he despises. It makes no sense to me.


My husband's first comment leaving the theater was that there wasn't enough humor, so I find it interesting that the opposite criticism is presented here. I enjoyed the humor in the fight scene, that made it less boring.

I agree the stakes weren't that high. Rhodes did get wounded, but by the end it looks like he's going to be fine, he's being re-educated and stuff. I thought the killed him off, and that would have been more dramatic, although he's a side character so killing him off of all people would still have been cheap.

I don't think the end is the same as the beginning though. There are definite tension. I don't think it was much of a Civil War though. I've been calling the movie "Civil Argument" ever since seeing it.

I was surprised that Cap was wrong. I expected to be on Cap's side, not Tony's, but I totally disagreed with Cap the whole way. With his methods, with his reasoning. I don't think they pushed his side at all. The thing he was right about didn't even matter, in my opinion. Okay, it wasn't Bucky who blew it up. But if it had been Bucky, that would have just meant he was being mind controlled again, and they should have gone after the person controlling him. For that matter, why was the reaction to seeing his face trying to kill him and not trying to figure out who mind-controlled him? Again, the villain predicted what would happen in a ridiculously accurate way since it relied on people not acting in a very logical way

I liked the movie overall. I would have liked greater tensions, as well as more humor (not all in the same place). I would have liked less of the stupid Cap and whatsherface subplot. What was the reasoning there? My first love died, better start going after her niece? That was super weird. Plus they had no chemistry. At least Vision/Witch was very believable.

And of course there was the usual "blame the heroes for damage that would have been much worse without them". Such a common theme though, this movie doesn't bear the whole responsibility of how confusing it is. I think at this point we're supposed to accept it and go "oh, yeah, that. That's how fictional people react, this has been established".

I'm looking forward the the next movies. I liked Black Panther too, although I found him boring in pretty much all the scenes where he's in his costume. I enjoyed pretty much all the scenes where he isn't, though. Looking forward to seeing more of him.
Check out my webcomic, The Meddlers! (Currently not updating)
User avatar
Bebop Man
Posts: 4465
Joined: 22 May 2013, 22:55
First Video: The Pirate Video
Location: The Black Lodge

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Bebop Man » 17 May 2016, 11:52

I believe it was Total Biscuit who described Movie Bob as "an insufferable mewling hack".
Image
User avatar
Elomin Sha
Posts: 15774
Joined: 22 Feb 2008, 05:14
First Video: Max Effect
Location: Woodford Green, England
Contact:

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Elomin Sha » 17 May 2016, 16:29

Sounds about right. I gave up listening to Bob a few years ago when he started using petty nitpicking in his reviews.
The most unique, nicest, and confusing individual you will get to know. Don't be stupid around me, that's my job.
https://displate.com/elominsha/galleries
If you need art, I take commissions, PM me.
User avatar
My pseudonym is Ix
Posts: 3835
Joined: 31 Dec 2012, 09:28
First Video: Canadian Girlfriend
Location: --. .-. . .- - / -... .-. .. - .- .. -.
Contact:

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby My pseudonym is Ix » 18 May 2016, 08:57

In fairly typical me fashion, I'm go to weigh in on the middle ground.

I will confess to liking MovieBob and think he brings up some excellent points in that article regarding the fact that all the development within this film is related to the characters' attitudes and relationships, rather than their actual position in time, space and fundamental role. However, there is one crucial point to bring up here: it is very easy to argue, and indeed feel, that this development is very much at odds with the way the film sells itself from start to finish.

On the face of it, Civil War was a big-scale action concept a la The Avengers- it begins with an international scale diplomatic incident which remains omnipresent throughout the film, and has been primarily sold on a straight fist fight between all the giants of the MCU, plus a few smaller characters thrown in to add flavour. It sets itself up for scale, for cities to burn and gods to fall from grace. And instead, all of the real 'stuff happening' is rather quiet and subtle. The great battle between heroes takes place in a deserted airfield and the character development we see, although in my opinion rather interesting, is very quiet and insular in a film that sells itself on high-scale drama.

In my opinion, it's not that there is nothing at stake, but that what is at stake is apparently small in comparison to what the film appears to be going for.
"Let us think the unthinkable, let us do the undoable, let us prepare to grapple with the ineffable itself, and see if we may not Image it after all."
User avatar
Master Gunner
Defending us from The Dutch!
Posts: 19383
Joined: 29 Oct 2006, 12:19
First Video: How To Talk Like A Pirate
Location: In Limbo.

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Master Gunner » 18 May 2016, 10:05

I think that gets back to my main bone of contention (which has evolved slightly the more I think of it). The marketing and all the characters involved set you up expected a full blown "Marvel: Civil War", but the actual narrative is only between Tony, Rogers, Bucky, and T'Challa. Most of the Avengers are just there so they can have the "big fight scene", and don't really engage in the plot at all. It's a story about coming to terms with your past and desires for revenge, not about a "civil war".
TheRocket wrote:Apparently the crotch area could not contain the badonkadonk area.
Twitter | Click here to join the Desert Bus Community Chat.
Darkflame
Posts: 402
Joined: 21 Jul 2014, 05:06
First Video: Quantum Documentary

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Darkflame » 18 May 2016, 12:16

There is a central disagreement between two groups of characters so that seems to fall very much into the definition of civil war to me. As much as you can have a civil war when your dealing with a group of a dozen or less people anyway.
The bucky thing was only a *example* of the central disagreement. It was a example of "being made to do something we dont want too" (Which was Caps
objection to the acords) vs "we must be accountable" (IronMan and Co's view).

Revenge was certainly a strong theme for a few characters, of course. But the central division had nothing really to do with it. People choose their sides based on if they trusted Cap more, or believed they should have a higher authority to respond too.
If it wasn't Bucky, it would have been something else sooner or later. The team is fundamentally ideologically split now. And, yes, sure they will work together in future because they are all still heroes despite their differences. But the characters have all shifted away from eachother, and some of them have now shifted away from the support of the world at large as well. Its hard for me to think of any greater change to a film universe really. Physical changes due to "wars" and such dont exactly impact future plots that much by themselves.


---

And as for criticism there wasn't enough action or destruction? I dont even...go watch Transformers maybe? Theres enough disaster porn out there thanks.
http://www.fanficmaker.com <-- Tells some truly terrible tales.
--
Last update; Mice,Plumbers,Animatronics and Airbenders. We also have the socials; Facebook & G+. Give us a like if you can, it all helps.
User avatar
Lord Chrusher
Can't Drink Possible Beers
Posts: 8913
Joined: 29 Apr 2005, 22:53
First Video: Door to Door
Location: In England.

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Lord Chrusher » 18 May 2016, 14:12

I rather enjoyed the stakes being smaller and more personal in Civil War. I think it is healthy to tell different sorts of stories with The Avengers in particular and superhero movies in general.
Image
We are all made of star dust. However we are also made of nuclear waste.
Remember to think before you post.
Image
User avatar
Master Gunner
Defending us from The Dutch!
Posts: 19383
Joined: 29 Oct 2006, 12:19
First Video: How To Talk Like A Pirate
Location: In Limbo.

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Master Gunner » 18 May 2016, 18:22

Darkflame wrote:There is a central disagreement between two groups of characters so that seems to fall very much into the definition of civil war to me. As much as you can have a civil war when your dealing with a group of a dozen or less people anyway.


My problem was that they didn't really explore that ideological split between the groups. The plot of the movie was just Cap trying to save Bucky, Iron Man being a dick to try and make up for previously being a dick, and everyone else mostly teaming up based on who they happen to be friends with (War Machine and Falcon) or for no good reason (Hawkeye and Spidey) with some vague motivation somewhat shoehorned in on top (Vision (whose argument doesn't even makes sense), Scarlet Witch (who commits the initial inciting incident - which does less damage than had she done nothing - solely so Tony will try to lock her up, forcing her to Cap's side)).
TheRocket wrote:Apparently the crotch area could not contain the badonkadonk area.
Twitter | Click here to join the Desert Bus Community Chat.
User avatar
Psyclone
Posts: 1862
Joined: 13 Sep 2009, 02:23
First Video: Christmas Carolling on Halloween
Location: Walla^2

Re: Captain America: Civil War. Spoilers.

Postby Psyclone » 18 May 2016, 22:27

I'm just gonna jump in here and say that my biggest problem with the movie was the baffling font choice.


But also that I actually thought the movie handled the size of the cast fairly well even if the motivations were unclear for a lot of the characters. I think it did "large cast" a lot better than Ultron.
They/them/their pronouns

twitch: armadillorampant

Return to “General Discussion”



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 38 guests