They're made out of meat

Drop by and talk about anything you want. This is where all cheese-related discussions should go
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Dana
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Postby Dana » 12 Dec 2006, 00:32

Lord Chrusher wrote:Someone should do a RFC for Ninjas over IP (NoIP)


I could do that!
"I swear it," said the other mother. "I swear it on my own mother's grave."

"Does she have a grave?" asked Coraline.

"Oh yes," said the other mother. "I put her in there myself. And when I found her trying to crawl out, I put her back."
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Lord Chrusher
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Postby Lord Chrusher » 12 Dec 2006, 01:00

JesterJ. wrote:I like Julias Ceasar's Method.

Anyone know it?

Translate this

h uyeer eyn isjys s a sta gm mjey


Okay, so I didnt have a good message...sue me


Lacerta wrote:If that's a Caesar cipher, it's gibberish...


Yeah I brute forced it. Gibberish. And if it is some other substitution cipher it is bit short to use frequency analysis and I am to lazy to use the Oddities of the English language to crack it.
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The Hitman
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Postby The Hitman » 12 Dec 2006, 11:18

Dana wrote:I could do that!


Do it!
"Just another Sunday paddleboat ride on a man-made lake with another lady stranger; if I remain lost and die on a cross, at least i wasn't born in a manger."
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JesterJ.
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Postby JesterJ. » 12 Dec 2006, 21:43

Hmm...maybe I have the person wrong...It could be not Caesar.

Oh God, I'm dumb..it's not substitution. It's something completely different. Sorry ><

It still works though, if you know what I'm doing :P
"Good thing we got Jester to carry." -Morgan, January 20th, 2009
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Misty
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Postby Misty » 18 Dec 2006, 21:34

I've found the perfect picture for this thread.

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I love Deviantart.
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DP
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Postby DP » 22 Dec 2006, 18:58

Morgan wrote:i'm not the least bit horrified to believe that all we are is meat. i'm a materialist, and quite comfortable with it.


I know this is a jerk-ish thing to do but I have not read any of the last 3 1/2 pages of posts. This reply is to Morgan's original statement, quoted above. Sorry for the wait, I had.. you know, other stuff to do.

Anyway, the following is not an airtight argument or anything, but I think my point is made clearly enough? Whatever.

Why materialism is demonstrably false....

What do I mean when I say ‘materialism?’Materialism was once taken to mean that all that exists are physical substances which affect one another through “push and pullâ€
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Melendwyr
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Postby Melendwyr » 22 Dec 2006, 19:13

DP wrote:Why materialism is demonstrably false....

What do I mean when I say "materialism"?


Ooh, I love how he immediately establishes a 'new' definition of 'materialism' that doesn't have much to do with the generally-understood definition of the word.

So materialism can perhaps be reinterpreted today to mean that all that exists is matter and energy, as Hitman implied. However, this too is contentious because many in the scientific community are interested in the possible existence of things like dark matter, dark energy, and anti-matter.


Let's see here:

1) Dark matter/energy are still matter-energy.

2) The possible existence of antimatter? The possible existence of antimatter?!
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Let's put a smile on that face!
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DP
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Postby DP » 22 Dec 2006, 21:45

You'll excuse my ignorance. What is your definition of materialism? Mine was as broad as possible to include most modern variants of empiricism. Is this not what we were discussing?

Also, my point regarding matter, energy and so forth was just to show that unless one is careful with their terminology, something like 'materialism' can mean all sorts of things. Furthermore, with new discoveries of science, the term may be adapted to mean crazy new things people never thought of before. It may be that someone turns around and says that even if phenomenal experience exists in a different dimension, it is still material. Well, that's just ridiculous. Monism is one thing, but claiming de facto that all is matter/energy is another. This applies to the comment about anti-matter as well. I don't know everything. I don't even know if you're implying that anti-matter is obviously fictitious or obviously true. It doesn't matter for my point to stand.

If that was all you had a problem with in my little half-assed job there, then I'm not too worried.
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Lord Chrusher
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Postby Lord Chrusher » 23 Dec 2006, 01:42

Drunk answer: you are wrong - you can not prove or disprove materialism.

Sober answer: wait until tomorrow.
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DP
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Postby DP » 23 Dec 2006, 07:51

Lord Chrusher wrote:Drunk answer: you are wrong - you can not prove or disprove materialism.

Sober answer: wait until tomorrow.


Just woke up answer: It isn't much of a theory then, is it? Why do I not believe in things like invisible pink unicorns (as the phrase goes)?

Didn't just wake up answer: I'll read your longer reply later.
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The Hitman
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Postby The Hitman » 23 Dec 2006, 12:16

To bring you up to speed on five pages of retarded, DP, you're making pretty much the same point I was shooting for.

The opposition held that the definition of matter should encompass all things, including things we may not have discovered yet. I had basically the same reaction you did: if we generalize matter to simply 'stuff,' what, exactly, is the point we are making when we acknowledge that everything is made up of 'stuff?'

Sure, you win the argument by definition if you employ that kind of logic, but your conclusion doesn't describe anything useful, nor is it the generally accepted definition of materialism -- it's more like... your own private definition, so you can be right.

Long story short: high five!
"Just another Sunday paddleboat ride on a man-made lake with another lady stranger; if I remain lost and die on a cross, at least i wasn't born in a manger."
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Melendwyr
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Postby Melendwyr » 23 Dec 2006, 13:05

The Hitman wrote:I had basically the same reaction you did: if we generalize matter to simply 'stuff,' what, exactly, is the point we are making when we acknowledge that everything is made up of 'stuff?'


Easy: we exclude the possibility that our universe is made out of things other than stuff. Traditionally, people have held that all sorts of things weren't stuff at all. This was incoherent and clouded thinking.
"...so he turns to me, and he says 'Why so serious?' He puts the blade in my mouth, and says 'Why so serious?
Let's put a smile on that face!
'"
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The Hitman
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Postby The Hitman » 23 Dec 2006, 13:07

Yes, I'm already aware of your opinions. I was trying to save him some reading.
"Just another Sunday paddleboat ride on a man-made lake with another lady stranger; if I remain lost and die on a cross, at least i wasn't born in a manger."
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Melendwyr
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Postby Melendwyr » 23 Dec 2006, 13:11

DP wrote:Why do I not believe in things like invisible pink unicorns (as the phrase goes)?


Because that's an incoherent concept, that's why - and that's also why you reject the idea of non-material things.
"...so he turns to me, and he says 'Why so serious?' He puts the blade in my mouth, and says 'Why so serious?
Let's put a smile on that face!
'"
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JesterJ.
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Postby JesterJ. » 26 Dec 2006, 19:16

I have 2 pounds of Parmesan cheese.
"Good thing we got Jester to carry." -Morgan, January 20th, 2009
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Melendwyr
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Postby Melendwyr » 26 Dec 2006, 19:23

JesterJ. wrote:I have 2 pounds of Parmesan cheese.
But you have quite a bit more meat.

Ummm, delicious meat.
"...so he turns to me, and he says 'Why so serious?' He puts the blade in my mouth, and says 'Why so serious?
Let's put a smile on that face!
'"

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