Doctor Who Season Four (Spoilers)

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Lord Chrusher
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Doctor Who Season Four (Spoilers)

Postby Lord Chrusher » 05 Apr 2008, 18:54

Discuss.

What the hell was Rose doing in this episode?
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Postby Melendwyr » 05 Apr 2008, 18:58

Fan service.

It isn't always sexual in nature. Sometimes it's fangeekery. Sometimes it's both.
"...so he turns to me, and he says 'Why so serious?' He puts the blade in my mouth, and says 'Why so serious?
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Postby Lord Chrusher » 05 Apr 2008, 19:10

Something tells me it is not fan service. I am guessing that it is more like the references to 'Bad Wolf' in the first season.
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Postby AeroCmdr » 06 Apr 2008, 00:57

It shocked me quite a bit. I was also half expecting The Doctor to not take Donna with him.
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Postby Heathen » 06 Apr 2008, 03:25

Rose, Martha and Jack (+Donna) were all confirmed as appearing (fully, not like that), at least once in the series, with Martha returning for half of the run and Rose/Jack apparently re-appearing for the finale, there's a rumour that Sarah-Jane will be appearing too, but I've not seen anything official to that end.
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Postby Red Charlie » 06 Apr 2008, 03:59

Any reviews I have read said that any of the doctor's ladys that have appear in the last two series should be at some point in this series reappear. It looks like Rose has found a way to break through the universal divide to get back to "our" universe.
It was really too big:

I give you this instead


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Postby Melendwyr » 06 Apr 2008, 05:45

Lame.

Like having the final confrontation with the Master, but hinting that he might be brought back.

If all of their highly-emotional (and often overwrought) changes don't have any lasting consequences, why should we care? If Gallifrey could be resurrected, why would the Doctor's loss be meaningful?

Bringing back Rose is a terrible, terrible idea. If they wanted to do so, they shouldn't have placed her in an inaccessible alternate universe and spent so much time and emotional energy on her inaccessibility!

Doctor Who seems to be on a sliding descent into suck. Pulp and cheese are one thing, but soap is quite another!
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Let's put a smile on that face!
'"
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Postby AndyTheSkanker » 06 Apr 2008, 06:11

Melendwyr wrote:Lame.

Like having the final confrontation with the Master, but hinting that he might be brought back.

If all of their highly-emotional (and often overwrought) changes don't have any lasting consequences, why should we care? If Gallifrey could be resurrected, why would the Doctor's loss be meaningful?

Bringing back Rose is a terrible, terrible idea. If they wanted to do so, they shouldn't have placed her in an inaccessible alternate universe and spent so much time and emotional energy on her inaccessibility!

Doctor Who seems to be on a sliding descent into suck. Pulp and cheese are one thing, but soap is quite another!


Iunno. You cant just kill off The Master. But Davies' writing is truly questionable at times. This writing a character off every series shit is beginning to get on my nerves. Let your characters live and grow for a bit FFS.
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Postby RobertMc123 » 06 Apr 2008, 07:06

I think they are bringing back Rose to bump her off and have done with it. Having her appear at random intervals through the series leading up to the end when she will be killed off and then no more Rose. As long as the same humour runs through the series I am happy.
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Postby AlexanderDitto » 06 Apr 2008, 08:10

IT'S OUT?!
WHAT?!
IT'S OUT?!

*Rushes off to watch it*
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Postby Heathen » 06 Apr 2008, 08:26

Yup, conveniently timed to coincide with the conclusion of Torchwood's second series.
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Postby korri » 06 Apr 2008, 09:18

meh, ok.. i guess you can't really do something to serious for the season opener...

i found the fat beings to be oddly cute...


as for the rose thing, i didn't particularly like her... so yeah don't really care that she's back, although if she supposed to have figured out how to come back, some how i don't believe it ...
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Postby Red Charlie » 06 Apr 2008, 09:46

Well her dad in the alt universe was a big rich powerful dude.

What really annoys me is the doctor is start to go emo. I hope he doesn't get all cut up about losing ANOTHER women in as many series, cos really that will put me off watching it anymore.
It was really too big:



I give you this instead





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Postby Heathen » 06 Apr 2008, 10:12

It's a bit of a dilemma for the writing staff, unfortunately. They set out with, amongst other things, a broad desire to remain true to the general principles of the original run, but were faced with a viewership that is now both more cynical and less patient.

So, wishing to avoid a series consisting of multiple serials and few, if any, long-term plot arcs (these were almost unheard of until Tom Baker's era), they pushed the new series into a more 'modern' format and took the companions that had previously served little purpose beyond simple exposition and plot driving, and gave them actual story development and a believable background.

Unfortunately this leaves a series that is no longer a one man show, so when for whatever reason a companion is to be written out, it's impossible to do so without forcing some sort of emotional response on the starring character's part, lest the aforementioned cynics deride it for it's (unheard of in a Sci-Fi!) lack of realism. I believe the only time the Doctor really showed any real emotional response to the loss of a companion was when Adric smashed into a primeval earth (becoming the 'asteroid' that destroyed Paul's people in the process).

Don't forget that originally, the show had a revolving door of secondary characters and it wasn't uncommon to see a companion last less than half a series. I personally prefer this slight increase in permanence despite the annoying bumps in the narrative that such departures create.
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Postby Graham » 06 Apr 2008, 17:37

They had always planned to bring Martha back, so that's nothing new.
But Rose... WTF?

Having said that, I really didn't like Catherine Tate in her 1-off Xmas Special, but she's a lot more likable this time around.

I liked the opener.
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Postby AndyTheSkanker » 07 Apr 2008, 00:03

I wouldn't read too much into the appearance of Rose. Russel T. Davies' script writing is erratic at the best of times.
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Postby Whatchamabiscut » 07 Apr 2008, 00:53

AndyTheSkanker wrote:I wouldn't read too much into the appearance of Rose. Russel T. Davies' script writing is erratic at the best of times.


I would use the term Schizophrenic.
Anywhos, I'm not a big fan of this Catherine Tate person, she seems more annoying than likable. If there could have been another companion like Martha or Sara Jane (from the original series) that would have been better.
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Postby Heathen » 07 Apr 2008, 01:31

I'm of the opinion that the only reason that Tate was invited to guest star for the Christmas special was that she was, at that time, one of the more popular family television comedians, hence why her character was basically a complete transplant from her show. At least they toned down her boorishness for this season.

That whole thing with the Face of Boe at the end of series 3 felt a lot like Davies had just thought the twist up at the last minute, plot holes be damned.
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Postby Unlucky » 07 Apr 2008, 04:14

The writing of Doctor Who worries me at the best of times....especially the "science" they employ. Of course though, I realise that it's Doctor Who and thereby any and all science in the show shouldn't be regarded as such. Still....I can't help but frown.

Now, the return of Rose irritates me to no end. I found her end to be one of the most touching exits of a character since -Spoilers for Atlantis season 3- the death of Caron Beckett....-End spoilers- and yet now she's back? It totally killed the illusion that she had been ripped away from The Doctor, all ways to be a memory from which he could never quite reach again.

Now what? She's back? They will reunite? Then she'll be taken away from him again? Pshaw. How...utterly pointless. I'm sorry, but they should move on....maybe with a few references, but never full blown encounters.

Which reminds me, Catherine Tate. I missed her Christmas special, but I had heard she was really irritating. I liked her in this episode, all though her attitude towards The Doctor could have used a bit of a pick up. :P

Official score? 6\10. Nothing spectacular....the start seemed really God awfully slow to me. I don't know why, it just did.
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Postby Heathen » 07 Apr 2008, 05:50

I'm somewhat glad that they've moved away from attempting to even sound like they're using real scientific terms in their proper place (e.g. wibbly-wobbly-timey-wimey), I don't know if anyone remembers the old Troughton episode where he makes reference to a "black star", but it was because at the time of production it was the term being used to describe what would eventually be branched off into black holes (although if I recall they aren't entirely interchangeable terms). At least by sticking to these campy, ridiculous sounding names for things (aside from occasional poor references to free radicals and the like), they don't seem like the expect to be taken as seriously.
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Postby Daco » 07 Apr 2008, 06:13

AlexanderDitto wrote:IT'S OUT?!
WHAT?!
IT'S OUT?!

*Rushes off to watch it*

here is 100$/€/whatever currency you use. GET ME THE SEASON MA BOY!
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Postby Melendwyr » 07 Apr 2008, 15:40

Heathen wrote:I don't know if anyone remembers the old Troughton episode where he makes reference to a "black star", but it was because at the time of production it was the term being used to describe what would eventually be branched off into black holes (although if I recall they aren't entirely interchangeable terms)


True: in Russian, the term used translates literally to 'black star', as the phrase 'black hole' refers to something... else. Euphemistically.

Hem.
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'"
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Postby emma » 07 Apr 2008, 16:51

Lord Chrusher wrote:Something tells me it is not fan service. I am guessing that it is more like the references to 'Bad Wolf' in the first season.


It is definitely fan service. That is pretty much the only reason she is back.
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Postby AndyTheSkanker » 07 Apr 2008, 17:38

Well, whyever the fuck she's back I guess we'll see soon enough.
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Postby AlexanderDitto » 07 Apr 2008, 18:42

OK, I watched this yesterday and was so totally OMG IT'S DOCTOR WHO for several hours that I forgot to comment on my impressions.

It was fantastically Doctor-Who-ish. The monsters were silly (sort of cute!), the bad guy was bad, and his Sonic Screwdriver was OH MY GOD all over the place.

Rose coming back pisses me off, not because I dislike her, but because of the fact that the actions of characters and the plot must have consequences, not flimsy temporary consequences that go away if you wait long enough, but real, serious consequences, if they're to have any meaning at all. The Doctor "loved" Rose. (Which I'm not sure I approve of at all, since it IS the Doctor we're talking about, he's not supposed to fall in love.) He lost Rose. It was a big deal, and it hurt him. If Rose just magically gets to come back, it's like all that melodrama from last season and two seasons ago just gets wiped away. If that's the case, why'd you make us go through it at all? Blah.

I like Donna. She's a nice change of pace from Rose and Martha and their youngness and peppiness and hot lookings attracting the doctor to them. She's loud and brash and a bit older but is still passionately fond of the Doctor. Variation in companions is awesome!

Martha can come back. That's fine, it makes sense, she didn't have much reason to leave. Plus, she's a doctor with a good head on her shoulders, and she only got a few episodes, all of which she was fantastic in. In fact, I'd be pleased if at some point the Doctor had more than just one companion. I mean, past Doctors often had two at a time. I think it would ease the romance!AWKWARDNESS feeling that keeps cropping up, and that I'm not so fond of. Also maybe another male companion would be cool? I miss Ri- I mean, Micky. He was annoying and stupid but had his funny moments.

Also, the bit about "mates" at the end was awkward and stupid and not well written. Truthfully, most of my favorite episodes are NOT Russel T Davis episodes. He's not a bad writer, he's just... aggravating sometimes. The Doctor isn't your soap opera floozy! You can't just muck about with him like some air headed bimbo.

I geek out for David Tennant so badly, though. He's so good. SO good.

And to Unlucky: you're seriously worried that people will think the "science" is real? Good lord, man, The Doctor hits the TARDIS with a hammer, a bell rings, and the damn thing spins off through space. I'm pretty sure the only people who would think any of it were true are crazies already.

The fantastic thing about Doctor Who, though, the thing I geek out about most, is that every time that damn box disappears and reappears, there's essentially an infinite gap for adventure. At any point in time, writers can go back and fill those periods with awesome adventures in strange parts of the world, and it won't conflict with the "time-line" at all. It's a fan fiction writer's wet dream. Heck, that's essentially what the entirety of the Eighth Doctor's adventures consist of.

I love this series so much, it makes me want to jump off of something. I'll be right back.

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