Roll for Treats

[Metcarfre]

Upon a rapid second viewing, I can append my previous criticism by saying that, in my opinion, the product placement stood out here because overall this cH episode just... wasn't very good. There wasn't much flow, the jokes were chuckles rather than guffaws (Though Matt's "Durandal?" poked a funny bone for me). The tempo was off and it felt stilted. Kathleen's beer girl costume and story - while I'm sure set many a fan's heart a flutter - was awkward and felt shoehorned in.

If you look at The Secret Life of Board Games, however, I found the overall video to be very funny, so the product placement didn't stand out as much.


[Moved from wrong thread. Post of Trixy's pointing this out deleted. -Graham]

[Graham]

Just sayin', I am really proud of the entire pre-title exchange.

[Ahlir]

Awww that post was adding to my post count. I'm almost up to 500 and I've only been on here 3 months.

[Wolfenbarg]

This one reminded me of Cash Cats. Intense giggle factor throughout, but it seemed to end just as we were about to have the group descend into chaos. Having everyone die right away and then quickly moving to the end of the video felt rushed.

It was very funny though, I enjoyed this more than the last couple iterations of Hustle.

[dackwards d]

I liked this video, especially the start and stinger, but whereas most of your videos are hilarious this one was merely funny. Still, it's a credit to you guys that when you don't do as well as usual you're still doing well. I wasn't put off by the product placement side of things, but this video felt less like a "funny video including a cool product" and more like "we were told to make something based around this game, this is all we got." The Feed Dump with the cards and the Secret Life video don't feel like ads at all but made me want to use those products. Roll for Treats felt like a funny advertisement.

[Trymantha]

it was mainly the excessive description of the product that really stood out to me, the this is an assault not one of those encounters bit to be precise

[DuelLadyS]

I didn't mind or notice the product placement (until the splash at the end, anyway), but things did seem a bit more subdued than I'm used to. I don't know if that's becuase it was too hard to write around this product or just a rare 'off episode' for me. If anything, I'm more concerned about the frequency of said plugs, with 2 of the last 3 LRRs being product-based. I think it's awesome WotC is giving you guys the props (literally?) you deserve, but I don't want it to overrun your natural awesomeness.

Also, Kathleen should come to my place next year- I'd give candy to an adult. I'll give candy to anyone willing to bring a sack to my door and say 'trick or treat'. (Although I give less if you're older and not in costume- but I'd make an exception for LRR.)

[Avistew]

I watched the video again with Sean, and I though I'd let you know that 1) he didn't pay attention to the product placement at all and 2) at the end, when it said "this episode was brought to you" (which I missed, I guess I closed the video before it showed that) his reaction was "oh, cool, they got a deal with Wizards of the Coast".

So it's not like everybody minded.

[Dibria]

Have to say, the placement did bother me, I think it was drawn out more than anything - I'm not sure how much you are obliged to say due to your agreement with Wizards but something along the lines of:

Graham: It's some new in store thing.

James: They've been doing that for years.

Graham: Not that, it's some new thing Jer's trailing.


While I'm sure you could better script that I think you get what I'm trying to say there, the dialogue didn't seem natural.


Personally I think the most damning thing is that I feel if this had been my first LRR video I probably wouldn't have watched a second, not because it was bad but because I would probably have just thought 'heh, that was funny' and moved on.

[Fenrir]

No doubt my opinion won't be anything that hasn't already been stated previously (and I'll try to be as constructive as I can here) but here goes...

Looking back over the video, and comparing it to some of the later cH videos, it occurs to me that the product placement is more prominent than it perhaps really ought to have been. Perhaps a more subtle approach with more of an emphasis on trying to keep to the over all (and pretty damn awesome) tone of the previous cH videos (i.e. I've always thought the cH videos seemed to follow from one to the next very well. This one just seemed kind of ... out of place, I guess ... to me) would have been in order.

Now...I really don't wanna make it seem like I'm "telling anyone how to do their job" or anything. Far from it. Before making this post I made a point of watching a couple of previous cH videos and I have to say this latest offering seemed very disjointed from commodoreHUSTLE as a whole in my opinion. As I stated previously one of the things I've always loved about the commodoreHUSTLE videos is that there's always been this sense of continuity to them and the product placement was always kind of woven into the plot of the particular video.

Overall - while yes, there were funny moments in the video - the product placement seemed to really detract from the humour of the plot.

Sorry guys.

[Aydin225]

i don't think the problem with the product placement is that it is blatant or forced. The cards used in feed dump were some of the most blatant product placement in history, but it was absolutely hilarious. I don't care how obvious the product placement is, as long as its funny. This episode had plenty of funny in it (ghost tally forever wins)but it also had alot of downtime of explaining the product.

I don't think its really as big a deal as we're making it out to be (again, ghost tally sooooo funny)because overall the reaction seems to be that the episode was funny. I think its just the first time this community is having to react to something like this, so it is a cause for much discussion and debate. I love that you guys have such a great relationship with one of my favorite companies, so please keep it up. Heck, do a graham and paul lets play of dungeons and dragons online or whatever, you know we'll all watch it.

[Fenrir]

i don't think the problem with the product placement is that it is blatant or forced. The cards used in feed dump were some of the most blatant product placement in history, but it was absolutely hilarious.

Personally I think the context in which the product placement occured is what's caused everyone to take note this time. Yes the product placement within feed dump was obviously blatant but at the same time (in my opinion at least) it's almost something you'd expect to see in feed dump and it was delivered in such a way that it made sense (and was almost woven into the overall video as a whole) with the end result being utterly hillarious.

This time though the placement just did not seem very in keeping with the overall feel of cH. Like Dibria said :

I feel if this had been my first LRR video I probably wouldn't have watched a second, not because it was bad but because I would probably have just thought 'heh, that was funny' and moved on.

[Geoff_B]

Having said that I'd watched one or two LRR vids before I really became a fan, and the vid that made me a fan was "It's Magic" which again was a major product placement episode, I'd say even more so than this one (dunno if it was sponsored or not though!) so I guess it's each to their own.

[Fenrir]

For me it wasn't so much the product placement but the way in which it was put across compared to the more subtle approaches of their previous videos.

[ThrashJazzAssassin]

Well, Encounters is actually forthcoming. Heh.

Sound:
I'm not hearing it. It sounds like any other video to me. I'm really sorry it sounds weird to you. Lemme check that there nothing wrong with the file...

Product:
Fair enough. Can I ask, in a totally non-confrontational way, is it possible that it's half too obvious, and half because you were looking for it?
Like, now that we've announced it, you know it, and it's more obvious to you, so it sticks out more?
I'm not saying that IS happening, I'm curious if it's a possibility.

Anyway, it's still a fair criticism, so I'm not shooting you down either way. I'm still pleased with the episode.

I think you guys will love the next (and last) one regardless.

Sorry, forgot to check this thread until now.

Sound:
It turns out that this video and no other video on the Internet sounds weird through my speakers and only through my speakers. It sounds fine through headphones, and I haven't had the same problem with any other videos, so... I'm gonna put it down as One Of Those Things.

Product:
To clarify my reaction, I agree wholeheartedly with met's second post. The problem wasn't that the product placement was too obvious, it was that it both threw off the pacing of the sketch and cut into time that would usually spent on jokes, leading to less funny all round.

If I might make a suggestion, I think that if this had been a non-sponsored episode and the game had just been an ordinary D&D game it would have flowed quite differently: everyone would have referred to the game more casually and the dialogue would have been funnier and less expositional, but it would still have been a video about the D&D game. That might be a good way to approach writing this kind of video in future. You can always go back and add in an extra reference or two later on if the product seems to have slipped too much into the background.

Anyway, that's my beef. Don't eat it all at once.

[Aydin225]

just went back and rewatched the episode two more times, and the product placement is really not obvious or intrusive at all. The only thing that could even be considered clunky is the sentence explaining that its not the encounters thing. There's really no expositional dialogue about what the product is beyond that its not for in home use, which works into the characters all being dicks to Jer and not caring about the consequences for others.

[Peacehammer]

Ok, I am coming late to the discussion, but this is my Internet, so you are all entitled to my opinion .

I don't think that issues with this video are caused / because of product placement.

In any video where you have to explain a thing, there will always be a bit of downtime.

Think of one of the most popular pieces of product placement of recent times - Old Spice guy.

Remained funny throughout, and yet was effective. Like all thigns, it is the writing which makes it.


I guess most LRR episodes happen organically, so when you are given a specific topic - a game - to work with, this limits your creativity.

I think that this is why product placement has such a bad rap.




Also, the monopoly moment with Paul is probably my favourite single moment in many a LRR video for a while. How many takes did you need for that?

[Dibria]

Think of one of the most popular pieces of product placement of recent times - Old Spice guy.

Remained funny throughout, and yet was effective. Like all thigns, it is the writing which makes it.

That is fundamentally different as the Old Spice Guy was a viral marketing campaign, it was not product placement, it was an advert.

In hindsight though I think I was overly harsh to the video, Commodore Hustle in general is not the best way to introduce someone to LRR as it has more in jokes and a continuity that expects some foreknowledge. I have shown people 'That's Magic' before multiple times but the most accessible Ch episode is probably Sickness.

I guess the problem was that there was something not quite right about the episode so everyone homed in on what was the most obvious difference - the product placement - rather than look deeper. I am not saying the episode was bad I just think the long wait between Ch episodes had everyone excited and then they were somewhat let down by their own expectations.

Or maybe I'm just projecting.