Dragon's Maze Previews

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Dubious_wolf
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Dubious_wolf » 16 Apr 2013, 19:58

So one thing i like about RTR. The back and forth "hate" cards really reflect "the guilds" in my opinion. So from a fluff standpoint, these guilds are all vying for power over one another. Especially after the dissolution of the guildpact. This is reflected interestingly by some of these card interactions.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Kapol » 16 Apr 2013, 21:09

The 'maze' cards all seem pretty good. But the Abomination and the Glider are both great, especially as commons. Flying is very powerful. Not only in limited either. Being able to give a lot of your creatures flying is a bit deal. And being able to give them all deathtouch? DGM is gonna be weird limited.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Utilitarian » 16 Apr 2013, 21:34

Y'know what I'm excited about so far? Virtually all the rares are things I'd be excited to see in a pack when drafting.

*edit* also who has the freaking TEN mana to Fuse Catch/Release? o_O

Seems fine for Catch though. I might have to rebuild my flickering Izzet deck with this
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Volafortis » 16 Apr 2013, 22:27

You mean 9, right?

But I get your point, it's crazy expensive.

Still, both modes have moments to shine, although I think that typically you'd simply rather run Zealous Conscripts.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Dubious_wolf » 16 Apr 2013, 22:29

It's a weird Izzet ability. I'm still trying to come up with the angle.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Utilitarian » 16 Apr 2013, 23:04

I'd run it WITH Zealous Conscripts ^_^
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Dubious_wolf » 16 Apr 2013, 23:10

Yeah.
Huh.
Problem is it activates at sorcery speed. So you can't take a creature, swing, then Sac it.
Actually yeah. How do these go on the stack? I assume it'd count as two spells being played and priority player chooses the order they resolve? Because you could make them sac a guy, then STEAL THEIR BETTER GUY. Or force them to sac the better guy to deny you it for a turn. Man this could be a wacky blow out card.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Dubious_wolf » 16 Apr 2013, 23:14

Oh god. "Catch" takes a permanent. Uuuuung! So sweet.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby phlip » 16 Apr 2013, 23:25

Dubious_wolf wrote:Actually yeah. How do these go on the stack? I assume it'd count as two spells being played and priority player chooses the order they resolve?

The exact rules haven't been spelled out, but I think it's done as an alternate cost with a text-replacement effect.

Regardless, it has been said that it goes onto the stack as a single object, resolves as a unit, and the left side happens first.

You'll notice that most the Fuse cards have some synergy between the sides, that often wouldn't work if they were done the other way around (fusing Beck // Call for instance draws you 4 cards, which wouldn't happen if it happened the other way around... fusing Far // Away, if it happened right-side first, they'd just sacrifice the creature you targeted). Not all of them are like this (Wear // Tear just fuses for value) but most are.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Dubious_wolf » 16 Apr 2013, 23:35

Oh.
...
Nine mana seems like a lot then.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Utilitarian » 17 Apr 2013, 00:09

Dubious_wolf wrote:Oh.
...
Nine mana seems like a lot then.

That's my feeling. Catch is still premium though. And if you had the mana I suppose you could use it to sac your opponent's Wolfrun or Drownyard, which could be pretty meaningful
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Kapol » 17 Apr 2013, 00:13

Utilitarian wrote:
Dubious_wolf wrote:Oh.
...
Nine mana seems like a lot then.

That's my feeling. Catch is still premium though. And if you had the mana I suppose you could use it to sac your opponent's Wolfrun or Drownyard, which could be pretty meaningful


Ummm... no you can't, unless it's the only land they have. And if you're playing it for even 6 mana and that's the only land they have out, you should be winning already. Don't forget, it's up to each player what they sacrifice. AND release affects you too.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby phlip » 17 Apr 2013, 00:15

I think he means that you can steal their land with Catch, and then sac it to Release, if you have the 5WURR to spend.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Kapol » 17 Apr 2013, 00:31

I suppose that's true, but that seems like a... bad use for it. Though I suppose getting rid of two of their lands could be good.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Utilitarian » 17 Apr 2013, 00:53

Kapol wrote:I suppose that's true, but that seems like a... bad use for it. Though I suppose getting rid of two of their lands could be good.

That was my intention. Frankly I can't think of many situations where Fusing Catch/Release is the right choice (or hell, where even CASTING release is the right choice) but as far as impacting the course of a game it was one situation where I thought the Fuse function could be useful.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Kapol » 17 Apr 2013, 00:56

Utilitarian wrote:
Kapol wrote:I suppose that's true, but that seems like a... bad use for it. Though I suppose getting rid of two of their lands could be good.

That was my intention. Frankly I can't think of many situations where Fusing Catch/Release is the right choice (or hell, where even CASTING release is the right choice) but as far as impacting the course of a game it was one situation where I thought the Fuse function could be useful.


Better situation: Steal Thragtusk, sac thragtusk, get token, ???, profit.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Utilitarian » 17 Apr 2013, 01:05

Man, but if I just use Catch I also get to swing with the Thragtusk and then use any other sac outlet, or even just Fling the damn thing... or hell flicker it to keep it. I feel like Release really should have just been a much cheaper spell with "or" instead of "and". Maybe Pick Two?
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Kapol » 17 Apr 2013, 01:08

If you have another sac outlet, or a fling, or a flicker spell. But yea, it's not a good spell.

EDIT, at least for the second function. Catch seems alright as a 3-drop that can grab Planeswalkers, especially with Zealous rotating soon.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Drecon » 17 Apr 2013, 02:45

I remember an article in which they said the left side of a fuse spell always goes first. We'll have to wait on the official ruling of course.
Also, all the fuse spells until now are made in a way that makes it intuitive to use the left side first, and then the right side.

On Catch/Release specifically: the card seems awesome. Catch is great as a tempo play for aggressive decks; Release is a nice control card that works against Planeswalkers.
Together they are very versatile and the possibilities are endless. My favorite play will be to use it while they have two creatures, steal one, have them sac the other (possibly sac a 1/1 token) and then just swing with everything.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Kapol » 17 Apr 2013, 11:07

So Emmara has been 'spoiled' (I put it like that since the source doesn't seem to be a sure thing). And, if she's real, she's pretty awful. She's a 5/7 elf that costs 5GW and has the ability 'Prevent all damage that would be dealt to creature tokens you control.' For 1 more mana, you could bring out Avacyn, who's just flat-out better. If she's real, then she's the worst champion by far in my opinion.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Lemegeton » 17 Apr 2013, 12:30

i call BS on Emmara. there is just no way they would make a champion that bad compared to the others we have seen
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Utilitarian » 17 Apr 2013, 13:13

She seems pretty awful. Creature tokens are indestructible might be believable but just prevent all damage? Eww.

Also... why wouldn't they just reprint Lightning Helix? Did we really need a slightly more expensive slightly more damaging copy of it? I guess it kills... Smiters? I would have rather had the original.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Kapol » 17 Apr 2013, 13:17

Glad to see I'm not the only one who thinks Emmara is shit. Even with Populate, she's just bad. I like most of the champions for one reason or another, but if that's all she is... I'll avoid her. The source is supposed to be pretty trusted though. It's possible he's just missing information.

Also, RE: Lightning Helix, because Lightning Helix would be pretty absurdly good in the current standard. Making it a 4-drop makes it worse since you're only getting 1 more of each, but I think it's still very good. It's might not be Mizzium Mortars level, but it's at instant speed AND gains you life, making it important. And currently, 4 is a very relevant toughness. Restorations Angels, flipped huntmasters, etc all die to it, whereas they wouldn't to normal Helix. Plus, it's only uncommon.

That said, you already have your Helix on a stick in Firemane Avenger, so why would you need another? :P
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Volafortis » 17 Apr 2013, 15:46

Lightning Helix was also uncommon. I'm pretty disappointed overall by both Emmara and the Helix. If Emmara prevented damage to all creatures you control, or even just herself and all creature tokens, it would be understandable, but as is, she's really mediocre.

It's times like now, when all the relevant removal in standard costs 3 mana or has a massive downside that I'm reminded why I stopped playing it.
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Re: Dragon's Maze Previews

Postby Utilitarian » 17 Apr 2013, 19:15

The problem with Emmara as she stands is she's just asking to be compared with Avacyn. They're both in standard right now, Avacyn can go in any deck Emmara can, and for one more mana you're getting a much better body, flying, vigilance, and not just damage protection but full invulnerability for ALL your permanents (not even creatures!) but ALSO for her.

for just ONE more mana you get what is possibly one of the bombiest creatures printed versus "meh... maybe if she cost 5. maybe"
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